starting strangly

dreamwarrioruk · Post by **dreamwarrioruk** » Fri Jun 08, 2007 9:15 pm

Help please,

very strange starting problem. not a regular occurance and dosnt do it on a constant basis when warm or cold.
symptoms
white smoke for 10 seconds out of the exhaust, erratic running then fine.
changed main battery as was only cranking at 420, now 900cca 95a/h changed glowplugs twice.
relay clicks in providing 12.34v to each individual glowplug which glow red hot. 11.72v to all 4 at once on rail.
Turn on ignition wait for light out. starts first time no probs, repeat when cold wait for relay to click off and it smokes. when warm wait for relay to click and it does it again. next day start when glowplug light goes off and its smoking. short run to warm up engine, turn off and restart about 15 mins later it smokes, repaeat same process, warm up and stand for 15 mins and it dosnt smoke. aaaarrrrrhhh.
no water loss, no power loss, no oil loss but plenty of hair lost.
im struggling to find a cause for this but its annoying me.
anyone have any clues to why its doing it.
95 bongo.

dreamwarrioruk · Post by **dreamwarrioruk** » Sat Jun 09, 2007 6:25 pm

Caps · Post by **Caps** » Sat Jun 09, 2007 7:50 pm

Are you saying that it produces white smoke on start-up when cold AND it produces white smoke when the engine is warm?
And that it does this intermittently?

dreamwarrioruk · Post by **dreamwarrioruk** » Sat Jun 09, 2007 8:26 pm

yes it does, no regularity cause it dosnt always do it but ive started to notice its more regular especially when the engines warm and been left for half an hour. white smoke usually means water but i havnt noticed water loss. the system pressurises theres no bubbles in the radiator or frothing of the oil or any deposits on oil cap, dipstick etc.

Veg_Ian · Post by **Veg_Ian** » Sat Jun 09, 2007 9:28 pm

White smoke can mean:

Bad glow plugs
Insufficient fuel supply
Restricted return
Bad injectors
Pump to engine timing
Low compression

The usual cause for this with the Bongo is plugs but as you've checked them and it does it when warm, I would check the other possibilities.

dreamwarrioruk · Post by **dreamwarrioruk** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 12:17 am

as recommended by someone.
pour a small amount of wynns diesel magic stuff into the glowplug holes and allow to soak overnight, then change the fuel filter with direct injector cleaner in it.change the oil and hope that cures the problem.
next step will be into garage for a compression test and gas test in the water just dont want it to be the head problem. dont have any problems once its started and runs fine no overheating radiator hot at top and return pipe cold.
i blocked off the egr valve last year with a plate over the inlet manifold, just wondering if there would be any chance that the gunk could have worked itself back towards the turbo end and so into the exhaust.there is a build up of oil and gunk around the pipe where i blocked it off.so might pay to remove the blockage from there and remove the pipe and clean it up. no gunk around the oil filler cap or in the crankcase breather which was full when i had the turbo pack up last august.

Veg_Ian · Post by **Veg_Ian** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:26 pm

I would be inclined to look for fuel restrictions first then maybe have the injectors checked out before looking to start spending money. Have you cleaned the small banjo filter near the pump?

Gunga · Post by **Gunga** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:12 pm

Can someone please help mike as he can not afford to lose any more hair

he only has about 6 now

Sorry mike couldnt resist
Chris

lez · Post by **lez** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 7:57 pm

I tried saving his hair m8y, had him on phone but I think its gone too far and he's down to five strands now..........

Gunga · Post by **Gunga** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 8:01 pm

heehee i heard he used that wash & go shampoo .... he washed and it went

lez · Post by **lez** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 8:09 pm

Veg_Ian wrote:White smoke can mean:

Insufficient fuel supply

Hows that work then?

as diesel engines dont have 'mixture' (IE fuel to air ratios) as such, how can less fuel change the colour of the exhaust smoke?

If this was the case, when I run out of fuel, my exhaust should change to white, I used to run out of fuel often with my dodgy tank level sender and it never did...........

dreamwarrioruk · Post by **dreamwarrioruk** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 9:15 pm

been to bridlington today, have noticed some coolant loss about 1/2 litre so its going somewhere. if i had a small crack or damaged head gasket when the engine was warm would the pressure in the cooling system allow some water to be forced into one of the cylinders and then be ejected out of the exhaust as steam when its started or would there be a constant stream of white out of the back, has not overheated and dosnt go past 11 oclock on the meter

lez · Post by **lez** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 9:25 pm

dreamwarrioruk wrote:have noticed some coolant loss about 1/2 litre so its going somewhere.

ever thought its just reached its optimum level allowing for airgap/expansion/weak spring on pressure cap?

if i had a small crack or damaged head gasket when the engine was warm would the pressure in the cooling system allow some water to be forced into one of the cylinders

Yes and no, and the loss would continue until you had no water, so thats out the window as a theory (I have had about 6 head failures on multiple vehicles)(note to self: stop thrashing engines on motorways)

and then be ejected out of the exhaust as steam when its started or would there be a constant stream of white out of the back

yes called steam, not white smoke, would leave exhaust very damp and wet to touch.

, has not overheated and dosnt go past 11 oclock on the meter

most engineers minds work the same way, so thinking of your temperature gauge as a clock, cold is about 9, running between 11 and 1, anything over 1hot, over 2 stop the engine

of course temp gauges are not usually clock shaped, so you have to use your imagination.

mikeonb4c · Post by **mikeonb4c** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 9:48 pm

dreamwarrior - is it really coolant loss or just the difference in level between a cold Bongo and a one thats up to operating temperature. I know mine is higher when cold and resting than after a run. Just a thought (it would be a relief if it was the explanation).

Good luck

Mike

lez · Post by **lez** » Sun Jun 10, 2007 9:56 pm

he's just paranoid about heads/gaskets/cracks etc.......

I've seen his bongo run, its a bit smoky when I've seen it, and it is worse than some, but I've seen some engines worse than is, I think his (pump) is just set a little too near the 'smog point' and for some unknown reason, now and again goes over.

Mike you off down to Chris's tomorro? I may have to do a run to 'dodworth' but if I dont then I'm more than willing to go for a drive with you. (ahem)