IS IT WORTH IT

[ELZE]

Hello again,

After a new radiator, water pump, hoses, thermostat, top & bottom heater sensors, timing belt whilst we were getting on with it, it is now just possible that I may have a head gasket problem

got it back yesterday, ran it and heater was blowing cold. took it back for another bleed. Some air came out but not much. On the drive this morning there was a small amount of water but this sometimes happens to be condensate dripping off the van after a cool misty evening? Looked at header tank which was at low so I topped it up ( was it an airlock that had cleared?).

Went for my hospital appt. this morning and still no heater but the temp gauge is at normal Took it back again this morning and we went through the bleed /snorkel routines again but only fluid came out.

Now he does a head test and said might be a cylinder head gasket Now question is which one I am taking it back tomorrow for a full examination before the fitter makes a diagnosis but prognosis is not looking all that clever Prayer mats at dawn me thinks

Now this is where you guys come in as opinions matter

After just spending £1200 is it worth doing both heads (V6) given the age of the van or should I just quit and get something else?

Before we decide let me tell you that before we can do the heads the LPG stuff will have to be stripped off and made safe then put back together again, more money for the lpg fitter on top of all this. Its not the money its just that I can get a decent van for around 5k so cutting my losses and returns from the salvage money.

I was booked in for a bottom respray next week but that's all over bar the shouting!

At present I am toolting around in a Mazda 2 which is p*ssing me off big style

How much is a 2002 V6 worth with as salvage with a potential head problem?

Oh Joy!

[windywatson]

Hi,
Just because you are not getting heat from the interior heater doesn't mean the head gasket or heads have failed. I would have expected further symptoms than that.
I can tell you this though, I have 2 V6 bongos, one owned 10 years & the other 6. In my own experience the bleeding of the coolant system could still be your issue. I know that there is always lots of discussion on here about bleeding the system. Bear in mind that most are about the diesel as they are the most common. And yes the procedure is still the same, but the engines are not. I have had post bleeding issues with both of my vans. Having been at the garage with one whilst I explained to them how to do it. Having witnessed the total lack of air bubbles coming out after the system has been what you would think was a bloody good bleeding. And then over the next few days had the coolant alarm go off & panicked thinking the worse. Having then topped up a couple of times before it has finally settled down & been fine. So I had to make the assumption that there where still some pockets of air in the system that finally shifted.
I had a cam belt change done at a garage used by a regular importer/converter of bongos who had done the coolant on many vans, to be told that it was all done bleed etc & then 100 mile down the road had to stop & put nearly a litre of water in to get it to the correct level & then it stayed bob on without issues.
I would say that if the heater had been working well before the radiator change & doesn't now. It is not uncommon to have heater matrixes air lock on vehicles. There is always the possibility that if the engine coolant system was flushed that some debris may be blocking that matrix. I certainly wouldn't jump straight into condemning heads without a pressure test of the system to confirm a leak etc.
Hope you get a quick cheap fix for this.
Cheers.

[mikeonb4c]

Tend to agree with Windys excellent post i.e. don't panic.....yet. There are good reasons i think why improper bleeding can damage the head on the diesel. But there are not many cases reported of v6 needing new heads because of this. You need to find out why the heater is blowing cold, before anything else i think. How Bongo savvy is your garage?

[ELZE]

Hi,
Just because you are not getting heat from the interior heater doesn't mean the head gasket or heads have failed. I would have expected further symptoms than that.
I can tell you this though, I have 2 V6 bongos, one owned 10 years & the other 6. In my own experience the bleeding of the coolant system could still be your issue. I know that there is always lots of discussion on here about bleeding the system. Bear in mind that most are about the diesel as they are the most common. And yes the procedure is still the same, but the engines are not. I have had post bleeding issues with both of my vans. Having been at the garage with one whilst I explained to them how to do it. Having witnessed the total lack of air bubbles coming out after the system has been what you would think was a bloody good bleeding. And then over the next few days had the coolant alarm go off & panicked thinking the worse. Having then topped up a couple of times before it has finally settled down & been fine. So I had to make the assumption that there where still some pockets of air in the system that finally shifted.
I had a cam belt change done at a garage used by a regular importer/converter of bongos who had done the coolant on many vans, to be told that it was all done bleed etc & then 100 mile down the road had to stop & put nearly a litre of water in to get it to the correct level & then it stayed bob on without issues.
I would say that if the heater had been working well before the radiator change & doesn't now. It is not uncommon to have heater matrixes air lock on vehicles. There is always the possibility that if the engine coolant system was flushed that some debris may be blocking that matrix. I certainly wouldn't jump straight into condemning heads without a pressure test of the system to confirm a leak etc.
Hope you get a quick cheap fix for this.

Thanks for the info, I personally am not convinced (yet) that the heads are a problem but I was just speculating. The rear heater matrix and pipes were renewed about a month before the rad went so I know that is ok but could still be an airlock. This morning I needed to top up the header but that was only about 1 lt not much really. This is why I want him to take it back in, remove the under cover and let it stand overnight so he can check for leaks first. Once on the ramp he can access the hoses and actually feel for temperature differences.
I have noticed that with the new stat it is changing over to Lpg a lot quicker than usual ??

I will keep posting the progress and outcome as we go

Thanks again for the heads up. I love the V6 in reality










Cheers.

[ELZE]

Tend to agree with Windys excellent post i.e. don't panic.....yet. There are good reasons i think why improper bleeding can damage the head on the diesel. But there are not many cases reported of v6 needing new heads because of this. You need to find out why the heater is blowing cold, before anything else i think. How Bongo savvy is your garage?

Well Mike he has had both my bongo's and seems quite knowledgeable. Also I have helped him along with various posts and info over the last 3 yrs. he gets plenty of Bongo's in mostly for welding and leaks tho'

As I said to Windy we will start with process of elimination, leak investigation first, airlocks/bleeding then head tests

Cheers

[teenmal]

I think the simplest thing to do would be to check that the diverter flaps inside the heater box are operating as they should. If ok then check the Coolant Flow and Temperature In and Out of the heater Matrix.

What temperature is the engine coolant running ?.

[ELZE]

I think the simplest thing to do would be to check that the diverter flaps inside the heater box are operating as they should. If ok then check the Coolant Flow and Temperature In and Out of the heater Matrix.

What temperature is the engine coolant running ?.

Not sure how I would know that except that when purging the snorkel temp is hot, engine temp is normal and nothing looks out of place except cool to luke warm air at the vents when heater is on

[mikeonb4c]

Tend to agree with Windys excellent post i.e. don't panic.....yet. There are good reasons i think why improper bleeding can damage the head on the diesel. But there are not many cases reported of v6 needing new heads because of this. You need to find out why the heater is blowing cold, before anything else i think. How Bongo savvy is your garage?

Well Mike he has had both my bongo's and seems quite knowledgeable. Also I have helped him along with various posts and info over the last 3 yrs. he gets plenty of Bongo's in mostly for welding and leaks tho'

As I said to Windy we will start with process of elimination, leak investigation first, airlocks/bleeding then head tests

Cheers

Ok so we should be able to eliminate inexperience at bleeding Bongos as a possible issue. Presumably you can take it back and say nicely to him 'the heater worked before this work was done but isn't now - can you find out why and advise how to fix it.'

Teenmal's points are good.

[Bob]

Could it be something as simple as the heater control rods come off that quadrant thingy which moves the flaps to direct hot/cold air?

[mikeonb4c]

Could it be something as simple as the heater control rods come off that quadrant thingy which moves the flaps to direct hot/cold air?

I think that's one of the possibilities teenmal is flagging up - definitely needs eliminating from enquiries

[rita]

I would also check out the Thermostat .

[mikeonb4c]

I would also check out the Thermostat .

Reading his post (concealed as it got caught up in the quotation section), it looks like he's had a new thermostat

I have noticed that with the new stat it is changing over to Lpg a lot quicker than usual ??

[rita]

Alas new thermostats have bee found to be faulty.

The secret in fault finding is "Not what has been Done" but "Needs to be done".

Good Luck.

[ELZE]

Tend to agree with Windys excellent post i.e. don't panic.....yet. There are good reasons i think why improper bleeding can damage the head on the diesel. But there are not many cases reported of v6 needing new heads because of this. You need to find out why the heater is blowing cold, before anything else i think. How Bongo savvy is your garage?

Well Mike he has had both my bongo's and seems quite knowledgeable. Also I have helped him along with various posts and info over the last 3 yrs. he gets plenty of Bongo's in mostly for welding and leaks tho'

As I said to Windy we will start with process of elimination, leak investigation first, airlocks/bleeding then head tests

Cheers

Ok so we should be able to eliminate inexperience at bleeding Bongos as a possible issue. Presumably you can take it back and say nicely to him 'the heater worked before this work was done but isn't now - can you find out why and advise how to fix it.'

Teenmal's points are good.

I agree totally Mike and that is what I am doing tomorrow morning after speaking to them today. They are a good garage all family and have been there for donkey's years, never had a complaint so far !

[ELZE]

I would also check out the Thermostat .

Stat was renewed same time as radiator as was temp plug top and bottom & water pump!