Trail Breaker

[cmm303]

http://trailbreaker.brookmiller.co.uk/p ... l-breaker/

Camper "van" with a difference. Unusual approach.
Sonething for the sparkies. As soon as forum users enquire about running kettles or heaters off their LB we know the advice given The trailer breaker salesman started telling me about the battery mounted in the base of the roof. I comment that surely they could find a space somewhere in the main vehicle. He replies, not for 400Ah of batteries. What! Turns out that the space heating/cooling, water heating, cooker are all leccy. The only gas is in the pull-out outside cooker. No diesel heater either. I walk away gob smacked.

[Bob]

That's some weight a long way off the ground.

[g8dhe]

Umm, do the sums .. space heating let's say a 2Kw fan heater? If it's 12V then that's 166Amps, so 400AH battery will last 3hours, now turn on the cooker 2 hobs? That's another 2Kw, so now only 1.5 hours and the cabling has to handle 300Amps?
Now let's look at the specs, 3 versions, alloys, audio system, nothing about the Motorhome aspects at all!!! Methinks it's Salesman talk!!!!

[Bob]

Ahh, forked tongue.

[cmm303]

Umm, do the sums .. space heating let's say a 2Kw fan heater? If it's 12V then that's 166Amps, so 400AH battery will last 3hours, now turn on the cooker 2 hobs? That's another 2Kw, so now only 1.5 hours and the cabling has to handle 300Amps?
Now let's look at the specs, 3 versions, alloys, audio system, nothing about the Motorhome aspects at all!!! Methinks it's Salesman talk!!!!

Geoff, I knew it would catch your attention. He tried convincing me that it was the type of batteries. My reply was an Ah is an Ah! I will add that the trail-breaker is new to this country, but been around in the middle East for a while. Might explain something - it has lots of solar panels.

Anyway, I've entered for free hire of one!!

[Bob]

Chris, if you gt the free hire bring it to Stourport.

We'll all take a look at it.

[Bongolia]

Whatever they claim its butt ugly.

[mikeonb4c]

The irony is that out in the sun baked outback you could teflon coat the bonnet and cook on that

Maybe there's a serious point here though in that the bank of batteries is there to take max advantage of the solar charging energy available in the outback day, so as to give max useable power in the dark hours. Also, if the batteries aren't lead acid then both the weight per Ah decreases and (i think but geoff could advise) peak power potential increases (as does maybe being able to use more than 50% of their capacity). All of which makes you wonder whether Bongo owners with cash to burn could have a much better off grid setup with lithium ion batteries and solar panels.

Over to you Geoff, as our maestro on Things Electric

[g8dhe]

As above AmpHours is AmpHours says nothing about size or weight or technology, the only other factor that needs specifying is voltage, they might be 24 volts the might be 48 Volts in which case double or quadruple the time, but I doubt it.
The problem with higher voltages is that once you exceed 12volts the choice of devices starts to decrease rapidly, 24 volt a range but not much choice, 48 volt you would practically have to invert up to mains voltage and use domestic devices but then they are not usually designed to be as efficient.

[cmm303]

He said something about Lithium but this was after he had tried convincing me that designing batteries into the base of the roof pod, and therefore at vehicle roof height, was good for stability I had started to exercise skills normally reserved for SWMBO and the mother-in-law, that of complete deafness.

Yup not the prettiest "conversion". A bit Bear Grylls meets technology.

[mikeonb4c]

As above AmpHours is AmpHours says nothing about size or weight or technology, the only other factor that needs specifying is voltage, they might be 24 volts the might be 48 Volts in which case double or quadruple the time, but I doubt it.
The problem with higher voltages is that once you exceed 12volts the choice of devices starts to decrease rapidly, 24 volt a range but not much choice, 48 volt you would practically have to invert up to mains voltage and use domestic devices but then they are not usually designed to be as efficient.

Totally get the Amp Hrs thing but was thinking that maybe lithium ion could handle higher discharge rates without voltage drop plus be able to do that much closer to full discharge than lead acid. Could any of that be true. Could be useful if so.

Useful spin-off acting as cab heater also during high discharge

[g8dhe]

The battery if Li-Ion can indeed handle the discharge rate, no problems, but its the size of the wiring needed when handling 300 Amps or more which is the problem!! You need 40mm² to handle 240Amps which is 11.8mm diameter, thats THICK !!!!! and that would still only handle a 2Kw Space heater and one hob!!

[mikeonb4c]

The battery if Li-Ion can indeed handle the discharge rate, no problems, but its the size of the wiring needed when handling 300 Amps or more which is the problem!! You need 40mm² to handle 240Amps which is 11.8mm diameter, thats THICK !!!!! and that would still only handle a 2Kw Space heater and one hob!!

Hmmmm yes. You'd need to step the voltage up at battery end then down again at appliance end to get around that, with all the inefficiency and complexity associated with that.

Mind you, aren't there more efficient/less power hungry scenarios? Microwave or halogen cooking/heating for example? Do you need more than a 500w heater in a small space with humans in it?

[g8dhe]

The real problem is lack of specifications in the advert! If your selling a motorhome, its the home i'm interested in, not the colour quality of alloy wheels and features of the HiFi .....