Coolant advice - safe to drive or needs bleeding

[dnitu001]

Hello all, long time between posts 4 years or more.

My question?
is it ok to drive a bongo after hayden alarm has gone off. header tank had 2mm of water left in after putting stick into the tank.

On garages advice filled the header tank with tap water and it took 500mls of water to stop hayden alarm and bring the level in the header tank to 3/4 up between the min and max mark on the header tank.

So van now has correct level of coolent in the tank. (but has not be bleed since the level dropped)

Or do I need to wait a week for the garage to come out and rebleed the system before I move the van.

No not in breakdown. (and it's outside my house)

The circumstances for better understanding.

Van passed it MOT last week. But while getting it ready for its MOT, noticed a bulge in the bleed pipe. All ok no problems and no leaks. This bit was fine.

So yesterday took the van upto sheffield to a garage who advertise as bongo specialists. Had the hose changed and new 2 year coolant put in (replacing the 5 year old stuff). very interesting that I was charged for 5L of coolant. (I thought that bongo needs 13L to do a coolant change. All hoses checked by garage and told ok to drive. Lunch time job finished and paied and left.

Drove home. No alarms from Hayden alarm, or mason alarm and all ok.

7pm leave house to buy milk, van alarming and red led lit. hayden alarm going off!!!!!!

email hayden, (jo emails back saying check voltage drop) 12.77 at battery (just charged) 8.5 at hayden alarm!!!!

open the header tank, put stick in and just the very bottom 2mm of the stick was covered by liquid. (small bit of advice I found out today. wood stick is very hard to see the level. The emery board that Hayden uses on youtube for the bleed demo looks a lot better. pinched one from girlfriend and have put it in the van in the emergency kit )

So my question???

rang garage this morning Friday. to explain circumstances and give them the 1st chance to sort it out and advice. (my impression that after paying full price for a hose change and coolant change, and after saying happy for any hoses to be changed if needed, and being told that the hoses where ok, That they should sort out the problem) Stated I was happy to pay if it turns out the 3 fates have managed to cause a leak elsewhere in system in the 7 hours since the garage had it.

garage said put water in and see how much it takes to fill up. ! We cannot get anyone to you for a week!

put in 500mls, and at the end of this hayden alarm went off.

Garage say it should be ok? is this right?

agreed to do the safest thing. Wait for a few hours and see if the level drops, and the hayden alarm goes off again.

Can I just say. Hayden alarm has obviously saved my van from a potentially driving it with a low coolant level. The service was great from Jo at Hayden and this is 5 years after I bought the alarm. Thank you.

just to note van had new mazda radiator change as a precaution 4 1/2 years ago.

[cmm303]

You are right to be cautious. It should be bled before driving and checked for leaks. Just don't know how much air has been drawn into the system and from where. Whilst you could have a go at bleeding it yourself there is an advantageous "commercial" clarity with leaving the garage to sort out their mistake. It also gives you an opportunity to see how they go about bleeding. However if the garage want to top up and drive without bleeding you may have to lie down chained to the front of the Bongo. Make notes about what work has been done when and what calls have been made in case it drags on.

Bill for coolant: maybe you were charged for the amount of concentrate used, not the diluted volume. I wouldn't expect to pay for the water used to dilute it!!

[dnitu001]

Hi CMM303

that was my thoughts. regarding the driving and bleeding.

wanted a opinion from someone outside.

yes understand what you mean about the Water

where I was trying to come from. by my calculations 5L into a 13L coolant system is 38.4% - going into winter that is below the 40% recommended and now I've diluted it at the garage's advice, by another 4% or so, so its about 35% antifreeze coolant now.

Unless they left in the pink 5 year stuff. But I thought it was best practice to remove the old, and not mix pink and blue.

thanks for the post and the advice.

[haydn callow]

Just top up with a bit of neat coolant.......30% mix is o.k for all but the really cold winter mornings.
If you had some coolant showing on the dip stick you should be o.k as that leaves plenty in the tank....you MUST NOT let the tank empty.........if you are still losing coolant ...find out where/why and get it fixed ASAP. Probably a good idea to get it re-bled just to be safe and ton traduced a bit of neat coolant.

[dnitu001]

Hello haydn.

Thanks for the advice.

that bike rack you sold me and the stronger dampeners are still going strong.

hope you are keeping well.

best wishes

david

[cmm303]

Just top up with a bit of neat coolant.......30% mix is o.k for all but the really cold winter mornings.
If you had some coolant showing on the dip stick you should be o.k as that leaves plent in the tank....you MUST NOT let the tank empty.........if you are still losing coolant ...find out where/why and get it fixed ASAP. Probably a good idea to get it re led just to be safe and ton traduced a bit of neat coolant.

Apologies, I was a tad over cautious. (I've never had to resort to the dipstick test but can see that it would test down to a ledge raised well above the level of the black pipe. Live and learn!).

[Gasy]

It can not of been blead properly or has a leak
If it's requiring topping up with coolant
Surely

I would want a better response from a bongo garage than that one
Even with a LCA I'd
Keep a close eye on the coolant in the header tank for a few journeys

Think I was told 7ltrs of coolant required
And to fill header tank to the full line when cold

[Simon Jones]

Unless you use a vacuum method or undo all the hoses you are never going to get all the liquid out so it's possible there was a good few litres left in there so 5 litres of new coolant + fresh water is fine. It is vital if changing from longlife OAT coolant to more traditional glycol mix (or vice versa) that the system is thoroughly flushed out and there can be compatibility issues resulting in it turning into a gloopy sludge.

Not 100% sure on the logic of changing from a 5 year coolant to a 2 year on as it means disturbing and re-bleeding the system more frequently the necessary. It is normal for the level to drop after it has cooled down after a bleed which is why it is vital to check the level again for the next couple of days after a bleed until it settles down.

I'd also recommend watching the YouTube videos on bleeding and learning to do it yourself in case you need to do it in an emergency one day. I had to do it once in Poland when a hose sprang a leak so it's best to be prepared.

[dnitu001]

Hello simon

the reason I changed from 5 year to to 2 year.

Was - to prevent problems and before any problems occured had new radiator - water pump and belts - done by wellside derby 4 years ago. (who did not want to do the repair of the bleed hose this time, I phonned them first to book a bleeding hose change and bleed.) T5 converter now(my impression)?

planned for a major service next spring prior to trip to germany in May 2016. Where I will be changing the belts and waterpump and thermostat. (just not saved up the money for this yet!) + van is only 6000 miles on from last major service by Ian taylor.

The van just had a new bleeding hose this time, so was decided between me and the garage to put 2 year in (blue).

Since the drop in the coolant level, at the garages request over the phone. The coolant has been topped up and the level has stayed the same over the last 18 hours. (not driven) (cold)

I await the garage to confirm in writting what they wish me to do next. (they seem to be watching this topic on the forum)

my understanding. of their position "probably be ok" "should be ok now its been topped up" "needs to be driven to see what happens to the level"

I will drive the car as they requested when they (garage) write and say that the car is ok, following the top up of the coolant + they will cover the head and engine for a resonable time.

So far I have told the garage of the problem as soon as I could. Done all they have asked, (expect drive the car! unless they confirm in writting that this is what they wish me to do) (obviously I am concerned by this, reason for the topic to ensure my concerns are justified, or as the garage say "their seems to be a paranoia about bongo's and bleeding" in our experience should be ok)

I continue to offer the garage the bongo to carry out repair or inspection prior to be driven. (for a resonable amount of time)

will keep you posted

[rita]

Quote....

email hayden, (jo emails back saying check voltage drop) 12.77 at battery (just charged) 8.5 at hayden alarm!!!


Hi David can you elaborate on the 8.5

[haydn callow]

As far as o know that question was NOT asked by anyone at HAYDN ALARMS

[Simon Jones]

So there was only 2mm of coolant in the tank by which time the low coolant alarm has sounded, then the alarm is clearly doing its job so I'm not sure why the voltage would be relevant to the scenario?

If you burnt some toast in the kitchen and the smoke alarm went off, you should be investigating the problem with the toaster not checking the detector .

[dnitu001]

Hello all,

too keep on topic. my question is - is the van safe to drive or would it be safer to have the van rebleed and checked after the coolant level had dropped below the minimum level less than 7 hours after a coolant change and bleed by a garage. Which the haydn alarm perfectly told me.

The alarm worked perfectly. the alarm identified the problem. the service from hydan was brilliant - would recommed the haydn alarm to anyone with a bongo as essential. As simon says "alarm is clearly doing its job"

To answer the question -
It was dark!
Just been to the garage and had the coolant changed! I remember that previous posts had identified occassionally the screw can be effected when coolant is changed from 5 to 2 year types.

The alarm worked perfectly. My multimeter has a back light so was an easy check to ensure the alarm was working correctly. (I will never doubt the haydn alarm again. its the bee's knees.

the problem was in the dark it is very difficult to see the level of coolant when using a torch as the regually stained header tanks reflect the light and make identifying if (and was looking for something that was not their) their is coolant in the tank.

was easier in the daylight.

Yes - if the fire alarm went off I would not investigate the fire alarm. I would ring the expert - which I have done and I am waiting for the garage to forfill is responsibility under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 OR Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982.

Seems to be the opinion that it would be safer to bleed the van. So thank you for everyones advice.

I will write to the garage and await their response. Again thank you for the independent opinion and advice.

[haydn callow]

Changing from blue to red coolant can cause the sensor screw to become coated, not red to blue.
You may have been asked to check the voltage at the screw to earth, but I doubt it as we knew the level was low

[dnitu001]

just as an update to everyone.

Garage said they had no one who could come out. Certainly not within a week of the problem.

asked to run the van where it was - which is what they would do at the garage without the danger of driving it too them.

Van run upto temperature over 45 mins. All pipes hot - top and bottom of the radiator.

No coolant loss between the first day and today. So not a new leak.

Then on the thursday took the van up the A38 from derby with the heaters on full! Van ran ok and no problems.

So seems it ok.

What will I do in the future?
Well given the advice in the recent post regarding changing the bleeding pipe same job as mine and what the garage did and the poor bleeding job. Will be more careful with garages. (again).
Well forum rules stop me doing what I would like to do.

But learn to bleed the van myself. (any offers please)

david.