Electric fans

[helen&tony]

Hi
If you're towing, an external cooler is a must...the one in the radiator is a bit of a chocolate fireguard when towing...IF you want to get a bit more sophisticated, fit a small fan in front of the external cooler, but an external fan pointed at the lower radiator is a bit un-necessary as the radiator trans cooler is inside the bottom, and surrounded by cooled water.
Cheers
Helen

[mikeonb4c]

Hi
If you're towing, an external cooler is a must...the one in the radiator is a bit of a chocolate fireguard when towing...IF you want to get a bit more sophisticated, fit a small fan in front of the external cooler, but an external fan pointed at the lower radiator is a bit un-necessary as the radiator trans cooler is inside the bottom, and surrounded by cooled water.
Cheers
Helen

Hi Helen. I thought it had its own air scoop, suggesting that ramming air through it had some benefit?

[helen&tony]

Hi Mike...
That's the scoop for the turbo intercooler...funnily enough, I don't rate the intercooler much, either...they are barely adequate in the UK, but over here in summer...no comment...the other reason I fitted water-injection was to cool the induction charge. When it's switched on, you can sometimes see the inlet temperature drop 30 degrees if you SLIGHTLY hoof it!....and as I use methanol at around 30% , it tends to give a bit of enjoyment....
Cheers
Helen

[mikeonb4c]

Hi Mike...
That's the scoop for the turbo intercooler...funnily enough, I don't rate the intercooler much, either...they are barely adequate in the UK, but over here in summer...no comment...the other reason I fitted water-injection was to cool the induction charge. When it's switched on, you can sometimes see the inlet temperature drop 30 degrees if you SLIGHTLY hoof it!....and as I use methanol at around 30% , it tends to give a bit of enjoyment....
Cheers
Helen

Ah! Then, as you imply, the benefit of an independent transmission cooler fan might be questionable. And also, I imagine the radiator fans will do as much good as any extra fan could so maybe an over-ride switch for them might have value? Or might that over-cool the engine system? You've brought up a key point here - if the transmission cannot be easily cooled independently by a fan, it may be that the only reasonable course is increasing the transmission cooler size/surface area. Certainly, when Alacrity/Geoff has talked about it, he has always talked in terms of fitting a larger transmission cooler.

[helen&tony]

Hi
Mike...everyone quotes how good a Bongo tows, but I've always tried to quote that to tow, you really need an external cooler...any transmission specialist will say the same. Whilst the Bongo may tow, it doesn't mean that it's a GOOD tow-car, because quite a few will have gearbox problems when towing...mine included...they overheat, the vehicle slows progressively, and you have to stop and cool. I towed a pretty heavy load all the way here from the UK, only at a gentle 600Km a day , and the number of stops in each country made the journey a nightmare...plus 15 MPG!!!!. I've since added a transmission cooler, and looped the original out. I got a transmission cooler from Allans, and a supply of piping...It's the one he uses on Bongos, but I haven't towed yet...I expect to get a bigger trailer next year, as I want to holiday in Greece...IF IF IF the migrant flow has stopped...Greece is like a smiley version of Bulgaria...nice folk!
If I was to tow a much larger trailer / caravan again, I'd go for a larger cooler, and a cooler thermostat, as it will aid transmission warm-up.
Oh...whilst talking coolers, I was looking at a rather nice original but tuned AC Cobra in the '60s, as it tickled my imagination (not a flippin replica like every next-door neighbour has)...It was running 900 horsepower, and had engine oil cooler, trans oil cooler AND diff oil cooler
Cheers
Helen

[roosmith]

Helen, thanks for your input, welcome as ever! The point about the original cooler being wrapped in the main coolant was exactly the sort of input I was after.

If I have to I will install an external cooler. Looking around though I'm a bit confused on the options (and quality) of some of the offerings. Any recommendations?

[mikeonb4c]

What would be useful now is some pics of Helen's installation Is in an easy job to do, and what's the cost?

[rita]

It would be worth your time contacting alacrity.......

From Alacrity...

Without going into details here again, I have been fitting extra oil coolers to any vehicle towing anything sizable or heavy for 30 odd years & not had anything but good results. There are some on this forum that don't agree it is necessary or that they should have a thermostat in the oil line. I can only speak as I (& the transmission industry here & in the USA) find. If you tow anything of consequence FIT A COOLER, they are around £100.00 inc. vat & delivery (depending on size required) & are one hell of a lot cheaper than a transmission rebuild. My Bongo is used as a tow car & has one fitted, & they are not difficult to do. Remember, heat is the auto tranny's biggest enemy. Send me a PM if you want to talk sizes & prices etc. Geoff

_________________
30+ years working with autogearboxes - all day every day......for my sins

[mikeonb4c]

It would be worth your time contacting alacrity.......

From Alacrity...

Without going into details here again, I have been fitting extra oil coolers to any vehicle towing anything sizable or heavy for 30 odd years & not had anything but good results. There are some on this forum that don't agree it is necessary or that they should have a thermostat in the oil line. I can only speak as I (& the transmission industry here & in the USA) find. If you tow anything of consequence FIT A COOLER, they are around £100.00 inc. vat & delivery (depending on size required) & are one hell of a lot cheaper than a transmission rebuild. My Bongo is used as a tow car & has one fitted, & they are not difficult to do. Remember, heat is the auto tranny's biggest enemy. Send me a PM if you want to talk sizes & prices etc. Geoff

_________________
30+ years working with autogearboxes - all day every day......for my sins

Well found Rita. Geoffs definitely the man who can. It would be interesting to hear his view on blowing air over a cooler and whether it can be any subsitute for a larger one.

[roosmith]

Spot on Rita, thanks

[helen&tony]

Hi
I got my kit (a cooler and some pipe) off Allans...Easy fit, and regarding the thermostat, I am thinking for my purposes...it is often below minus 25 Celcius , and it REALLY takes a time for the transmission to change gear...and that was before fitting the cooler, but as Alacrity says, it's probably an un-necessary item in the UK...I just know the time it takes to warm is very different here.
Transmission aside, in winter, the bottom of the radiator won't get above minus temperatures in 55 Kilometers...I have an i-Alert gauge on the bottom hose, and I switch it off because of the alarm....it takes 10 minutes in traffic before it reads...so that's in temperatures of minus 8 C or thereabouts, and running at 50-55 MPH. All the cooling is limited to the top half of the radiator in a cold winter.
Cheers
Helen

[roosmith]

If a kit is available at a reasonable price I will snap their hand off! I've emailed Allans. Thanks Helen

[mikeonb4c]

Hi
I got my kit (a cooler and some pipe) off Allans...Easy fit, and regarding the thermostat, I am thinking for my purposes...it is often below minus 25 Celcius , and it REALLY takes a time for the transmission to change gear...and that was before fitting the cooler, but as Alacrity says, it's probably an un-necessary item in the UK...I just know the time it takes to warm is very different here.
Transmission aside, in winter, the bottom of the radiator won't get above minus temperatures in 55 Kilometers...I have an i-Alert gauge on the bottom hose, and I switch it off because of the alarm....it takes 10 minutes in traffic before it reads...so that's in temperatures of minus 8 C or thereabouts, and running at 50-55 MPH. All the cooling is limited to the top half of the radiator in a cold winter.
Cheers
Helen

Rightly or wrongly, I've been known to chock the wheels and put the Bongo in D whilst it warms up for a few minutes on really cold mornings. Seems to warm the autobox quicker so it's ready to change up sooner when I hit the road. My drive slopes upwards also, so overall no chance of Bongo moving off

[helen&tony]

Hi
Mike...
Don't ask me if that'll do any harm...gearboxes aren't my "thing"...I know what manual gearboxes to order when it comes to what I want, but I leave specialists to tune them...but I only know the principles of an auto trans , and whilst I like autos on larger engines, I despise them on small cars...however, as I have considerable joint problems, I need either a good light-clutch manual, or an auto. What I do know is that with towing, quite a few vehicles are quoted as tow cars, but NO MANUFACTURER specifically designs a car for towing, as far as I'm aware, and so just "bunging" a tow bar on the back doesn't make for a good deal. I seem to remember a glovebox manual in one of my Landrovers actually saying that they aren't designed for towing, but there again, the MILSPEC Lightweight Landies have 2.5 tonne trailers designed for them , I believe,...so how about that???? The other thing that surprises me is the number of Landrover "Experts" that apparently "prepare" Landies for fording by bunging a snorkel kit and a few "goodies" on them in an hour or two, when it takes the military goodness knows how long to warterproof one???...I had been told 8 hours!
Cheers
Helen

[mikeonb4c]

Hi
Mike...
Don't ask me if that'll do any harm...gearboxes aren't my "thing"...I know what manual gearboxes to order when it comes to what I want, but I leave specialists to tune them...but I only know the principles of an auto trans , and whilst I like autos on larger engines, I despise them on small cars...however, as I have considerable joint problems, I need either a good light-clutch manual, or an auto. What I do know is that with towing, quite a few vehicles are quoted as tow cars, but NO MANUFACTURER specifically designs a car for towing, as far as I'm aware, and so just "bunging" a tow bar on the back doesn't make for a good deal. I seem to remember a glovebox manual in one of my Landrovers actually saying that they aren't designed for towing, but there again, the MILSPEC Lightweight Landies have 2.5 tonne trailers designed for them , I believe,...so how about that???? The other thing that surprises me is the number of Landrover "Experts" that apparently "prepare" Landies for fording by bunging a snorkel kit and a few "goodies" on them in an hour or two, when it takes the military goodness knows how long to warterproof one???...I had been told 8 hours!
Cheers
Helen

Oh I'm not worried about the gearbox, I'm sure its happy to be in gear (as it might well be anyway if you moved off and found yourself in traffic). No its getting a lecture about the danger of leaving an unsupervised vehicle in gear I'm expecting. But I think that suitable chocked and facing up a sloping drive, it should be a responsible enough action.