Steel Seal

[ffrank]

I UNDONE TOP RAD HOSE AND TOPPED UP SYSTEM WITH ANTIFREEZE. ENDED UP LOOSING COOLANT THRU BOILING OFF AT EXPANSION TANK.SOLUTION...BLEED AIR OUT SYSTEM PROPERLY...FOUND OK.YOUR PROB COULD BE AIR LOCK.AIR IN SYSTEM..OR MAYBE THATS ONLY THE CURE FOR PEOPLE WHO F*** theirs up by being lazy...

[Spenner]

Hi
The Van that NB is referring to is mine and I did re-apply today as a last 'non engineering' try. My advice is follow all the good advice on the site in eliminating leaks and faulty areas of the coolant system - I went through the thermo, hoses, rad, and several bleed ups using the you tube video method before I decided to give it a try. (As well as NB diagnosing and testing.)
I managed 1000 miles on a van that wouldn't last 20 miles previously. I think I was partially successful last time due to slightly lower temp - although at 96 deg today it was enough heat.
What I noticed was less air bubbles in the bleed as the process went on (heat engine through 3 times and leave to cool between each) - whereas before Steel seal we were bleeding exhaust gasses all day long.
Not really commenting on reasons or morals or methods as I posted a brief history of my 'journey' on another thread in tech section under 'failed pressure test'.
What I will do is post updates on whether it worked this time and how long it lasts - I am hoping for a trouble free summer.

Best of luck Dannyboy with whichever route you try -let me know if you need me to expand on any of the info.

[Spenner]

Just to round this one off - I have tried steel seal twice. First time failed after 1000miles second one failed after approx 300 miles. When I say failed I mean coolant overflowing from expansion tank showing signs of overheating.
Decided to take the engineering route and the head is now off......
See my new post entitled HEAD REMOVAL.

[widdowson2008]

Not quite done yet Jeff. To keep this on record I thought I would add this info gathered today. Bit of a gobfull so bear with me.
28-07-11
Replaced Jeff’s stat and re-bled.

Sometime in March of this year, Jeffs Bongo was suffering from overheating symptoms. The system was inspected and faulty components replaced, the stat being one.

A new Mazda stat was originally installed to replace the one on the right which had had its jiggle pin removed and flange drilled.



This is the Mazda stat taken out after 4 months service (Note the chalky deposit on the underside - this deposit is quite thick)

– a genuine Mazda, which had been subjected to the following:
This stat was installed in March 2011 and replaced today after the following history.
Having replaced the original stat and found the overheating problem was still there, it was decided to try the Steel-Seal route.
The first attempt lasted for approximately 1000 miles before the system erupted again.
A second attempt at the Steel-Seal solution was made, but this only lasted some 400 miles.
The head was removed and found to be cracked.

We replaced the head and forgot all about replacing the stat.

A TM-2 was fitted with the sensor located at the metal pipe from the head (top hose).

Data was gathered and the system appeared to be running within the range 86 to 92°C, a span of 6°C.

Comparing these figures with my own (82 to 86°C) was when I realised that Jeff’s stat had not been replaced when the head was done, and a probable cause of Jeff’s higher temperatures could be that his stat had actually suffered a temperature which had caused the expansion tank cap to blow at the pressure of 1.1bar.
According to Grahame, the temperature at which the expansion tank cap will blow is 120°C.
At this temperature, the thermostat has exceeded its absolute full travel and will have lost some of its wax, resulting in a ‘lazy’ stat. ie subsequent temperature cycles will cause the stat to lift, BUT later than it should (at higher temperatures).

So before we change the stat today, we put both of them into a pan of water (side by side) and applied heat.
By the time the old stat started to move, the new one had travelled approximately 2mm which equates to a temperature of 88°C.
Therefore, this particular overheated stat was beginning to open at 88°C, ie 3°C late.

The new stat was fitted, the system THOROUGHLY FLUSHED, the Bongo bled, and taken for a test run.
The TM-2 now records a temperature of 85 - 89°C, a span of 4 °C (50% better than the other one.)

Any comments/ideas on chalky deposit?

[missfixit70]

Chalky deposit is Steel Seal, as I keep saying, if this stuff is used, it sticks like sh*t to a blanket & is a nightmare to get out, imagine the rest of the internals of the system, ie waterpump, rad & matrix internals etc. Personally I'd go for a thorough chemical flush & if a new waterpump hasn't been fitted since the steel seal, I'd seriously consider it.

[widdowson2008]

Chalky deposit is Steel Seal, as I keep saying, if this stuff is used, it sticks like sh*t to a blanket & is a nightmare to get out, imagine the rest of the internals of the system, ie waterpump, rad & matrix internals etc. Personally I'd go for a thorough chemical flush & if a new waterpump hasn't been fitted since the steel seal, I'd seriously consider it.

Thought the Steel Seal was supposed to just 'dissapear' when the initial heating reaction had taken place? or at least become totally inert.

Chemical fulsh didn't happen today I'm afraid cos Jeff needed the Bongo - time restriction (it's his only car now). However, we DID give each and every hose a thorough (and I mean thorough) flush through - Both ways. Got a fair amount of crap out too.
All pasages seemed clear. Even the steel pipe from rad bottom hose was a metal colour (brown before flushing). I hope we did enough.

[missfixit70]

The claim is that it becomes inert, but if it is left in it gets very viscous as temp increases (even after it's done its "thing"), but even after several flushings when I used it, you could see the particles in suspension & the viscosity of the coolant was still evident & there were chalky stains wherever coolant had dried. It is notorious for killing water pumps if you google it, chemical flush is the only way to clear it, & then LOTS of clear water flushing. You can see how it's caked on the stat, ALL the internals will be the same.

[Spenner]

Just to round this topic off here are my final experiences with Steel Seal

After getting the confirmed test report that the head was scrap I decided to take Steel Seal at their word and claim a full refund as I had tried two bottles and both failed. Incidentally they have now changed the website advice to buy 2 bottles if the engine is above 2 litres. Previously the guidance was 1 bottle for 4 cylinders and 2 for more than 4 cylinders - this has been removed since I purchased. and replaced with the new advice.

I wrote to Proppa (the distributor) named on the website - including details of the failure, proof of purchase and a copy of the failed head test/scrappage certificate provided by Foxwood diesels. Heard nothing back.
After a month I followed up by calling the number from the website. Graham explained that Proppa had gone into administration and no one would have dealt with my letter. He explained that he was running the company, and he immediately promised a full refund for both bottles
By the following working day after sending him my info he deposited the refund into my paypal account. Extremely good customer service from what looked like a hopeless case - dealt with swiftly - so I am impressed with their customer service.

Contact Graham from the number on the website http://www.steelseal.co.uk/index.asp?fu ... roductid=1
Address: Steel Seal Ltd, Mayfield House, Lench Rd,Evesham, Worcestershire, WR11 4UG

[gmaczbongo]

Good to see that refunds are now given when it does not work.
Soya sauce and steel seal