Snow Chains or Snow Socks??

Pizzer11 · Post by **Pizzer11** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 4:37 pm

Hi All,

I've read previous posts on these but no one seems to have any feedback on how snow socks compare to chains. The previous threads are locked so I thought I'd throw it back out there.

I'm off to the Alps for 7-weeks starting Sat. 02 Feb. The tyres on my Bongo are:

Front - 225/50 R16
Rear - 225/55 R16

Supposedly they are a bit of an unusual profile for standard, affordable chain set-ups so looking at a combo chain-sock option. My bongo is 2-wheel, rear-wheel drive so I assume I'll need some form of traction assistance on all 4 wheels, so I'm thinking of getting a premium set of chains for the rear wheels and socks for the front wheels. Anyone have any thoughts about this?

Pizzer11 · Post by **Pizzer11** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:43 pm

I read on one of the previous posts that because alot of the braking and all of the steering comes from the front wheels, that it is wise to have traction support on the front wheels. Admittedly the thread was discussing 4-wheel drive bongos but I fail to see how my rear wheel drive bongo is more apt at steering and breaking than a 4WD model. Also, I have spoken to a dealer and he recommended two-sets, but he might be just trying to increase his sale. Anyone else have any thoughts as to whether front and back traction support is necessary for my rear wheel drive bongo?

Are you basing your distrust of the socks on personal experience or what you have heard from others? Keen to hear from someone with personal experience of their use. Assuming it is most important to have chains on the rear wheels, surely the socks on the front wheels will improving steering and braking it snow conditions.

francophile1947 · Post by **francophile1947** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 5:47 pm

I've never used either, but wonder why the socks aren't so popular - could it be they don't work as well as chains?
I agree that chains on all 4 wheels makes more sense, to help with steering and braking.

brookie · Post by **brookie** » Mon Jan 21, 2008 9:00 pm

I spent 6 years transiting the Alps in an articulated truck from the UK to Southern Europe and I only ever used snowchains on the drive axle. The only legal requirement was for drive axle only ( October to April if I recall) and I never had any problems with that setup. As long as you descend steep roads using gears more than braking, you'll be fine. The only time I got worried was with a 3 metre snowfall going over Mont Blanc and I was the only truck on the road in the middle of the night, putting snowchains on in the dark and minus 18 was not pleasant!

Good luck and safe motoring.

Mark.

RobinS · Post by **RobinS** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:50 am

Where chains are compulsory in the alps snowsocks do not qualify, therefore you could be stopped from driving up mountain roads in heavy snow. The requirement is for chains on the rear only, but this does mean that on steeper downhills you will have very little steering or braking capability - not something I would fancy on a mountain road, so since for mine I found chains for only about £30 a pair I got two pairs - a lot cheaper than having to be pulled out a ditch (or worse!).

snow_kiter · Post by **snow_kiter** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 1:25 pm

Going to Norway again this year. Last year 2 of the vehicles (1 transit, 1 vito)
had snow tires fitted and manged the trip without chains. All the other vans and cars needed chains.

So in conditions like these would I need 2 pairs of chains on 2WD Bongo?

Captainsideways · Post by **Captainsideways** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:29 pm

NO chains only on the driven wheels!!!!!!!!!! simple as that, if you have a 4wd one then yes maybe but NOT a 2wd one.

If you want to save lots of hassle just get some snow tyres, safest, best bit of kit you'll you'll ever fit to a car for winter driving.

Pizzer11 · Post by **Pizzer11** » Wed Jan 23, 2008 5:43 pm

OK, socks vs chains aside, some people say chains on all wheels, including those I've talked to who sell them (though clearly they may have ulterior motives) and some say on the drive wheels only and on all 4-wheels only if you have 4WD. This is a quote from a post by RobinS.....

As the full time 4wd is not really - it is sort of 2+2, only when the rear wheels lose grip does power transfer to the front. This means that if I put chains on the back they won't lose grip, so it will be just like driving a rear wheel drive vehicle - it will go fine.

However: All propulsion will come come from the back so it will go fine, but 80% of braking comes from the front, which will have no grip, so it will barely stop, and 100% of the steering comes from the front so it won't go round corners at all!

Although my vehicle is only rear wheel drive, I can't see how the above doesn't apply to me and I fail to understand how chains can provide traction for acceleration but potentially limit traction for braking. I do, however, fully appreciate the need to drive in a slow and controlled manner. I visited Serre Chevalier in 2005 for a 5-day long weekend. It snowed everyday and the chains were required everyday on our front wheel drive rental car. I may very well only need them a few times (hopefully alot though), but even if I need them just once I want to make sure I have all bases covered.

As such I'll more than likely get 2-pairs to be safe. As Charlton Heston would say, "It's Better to Have snow chains and Not Need them, Than to Need snow chainsand Not Have them".

Still considering snow socks for the front wheels, mainly because of the arguments above for not having chains on the front wheels. If chains reduce "contact footprint" for braking, then surely the socks conserve contact footprint and assist traction. Still thinking about this.

OK, next question. Anyone fitted 16mm snow chains to their bongo? These are recommended by sellers as they're more robust and provide better traction (and probably because they cost more). The down side is they require more clearance around the tyre than most cars have (incidentally, snows sock have essentially been created to resolve this). Visual inspection of my bongo suggests there is plenty of clearance but does anyone know for sure from experience?

mikeonb4c · Post by **mikeonb4c** » Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:26 pm

What are snow socks anyway

francophile1947 · Post by **francophile1947** » Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:29 pm

mikeonb4c wrote:What are snow socks anyway

They keep the tyres warm and cosy

Have a look at http://www.roofbox.co.uk/autosock/

brorabongo · Post by **brorabongo** » Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:31 pm

Something like this, I think.
http://www.autosock.co.uk/

Edit:

beat me to it francophile1947

Pizzer11 · Post by **Pizzer11** » Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:08 pm

I'm thinking more of these Good Year Snow socks.

http://www.snow-chains.co.uk/product.as ... deptid=236

Seem a bit more robust and have those seams on every quarter which IMO must give more traction (which I don't think the AutoSock has).

Captainsideways · Post by **Captainsideways** » Wed Jan 23, 2008 11:24 pm

With chains on the rear drive wheels, you can still steer, still slow down using the engine (in D1 or D2 with overdrive off) and yes you can still brake though not a lot admittedly. But you wont be going very fast with chains on!

Plus 2 sets takes twice as long to fit & remove, your just being pedantic. I doubt you'll be getting stuck with one set of chains on anyway & you wont be doing more 25 odd mph with them on & you'll soon find some cleared road so will probably have to take them off again!

Pizzer11 · Post by **Pizzer11** » Wed Jan 23, 2008 11:47 pm

With chains on the rear drive wheels, you can still steer

Assume you mean with no chains on the front wheels you can still steer? Jury I'm afraid is out on that one. I'll take 2-sets and try just the one at first, safe in the knowledge I can add the others if need be and will report back in 9-weeks.

Forgot to mention that weekly I'll be doing the Serre Che to Turin track over the French-Italian border Alps to drop off & collect groups of mates who'll be joining us.....Precious cargo!!

I appreciate your optimism with regard to the conditions and the likelihood of clear roads, but I'll be praying for snow, much like I did last time I was there and the chains stayed on our rental car for 5 days straight. Motorways and main roads, sure they'll be fine; but small back roads, driveways, or the alpine traverse at night in blizzard?....who knows.

you can still brake though not a lot admittedly

That's me convinced, 2-sets it is!! So anyone fitted 16mm chains?

Pizzer11 · Post by **Pizzer11** » Thu Jan 24, 2008 2:12 pm

Hey Keefysher,

I can assure you it is not a wind up. If you read back I never meant for this thread to be a debate on how many sets of chains I should use. I was always going to get 2-sets. I agree that chains on the rear driven wheels will suffice, however, as many others here recommend and indeed the FAQ from skidrive.co.uk states with regard to rear-wheel drive vehicles, "The safer (but more expensive) option would be to run chains all round. This obviously gives consistent grip at both ends of the vehicle, and maximum resilience against harsh conditions."

So back to the original objective of this thread, which was to know if anyone had used Snow Socks on a bongo. The question has been asked before (twice in fact), this time a third and still no responses. I see now how comparing sock vs chains can be considered pointless as by law you have to carry chains, but I'll give both a go and report back. Thanks for all the advice.