Van Tyres vs Car Tyres

dandywarhol · Post by **dandywarhol** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 12:18 am

Sorry, talking rubbish as usual Bumbly - your profile etc. are there I just didn't see them

Are you well?

Bumbly1 · Post by **Bumbly1** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:17 am

roosteruk wrote:One thing anyone has failed to mention.
If you are towing a caravan, then the high load rated tyres are a must.
I got them on mine when I got my Bongo as I bought the Bongo to pull a caravan.

And the basis for that is?
A caravan should have a maximum noseweight of 75 kgs approximately together with excess loadings on braking cornering etc. Towballs for most cars (and vans) can be bought as official parts so one might assume this additional loading is taken into account, or should at the least be brought to the owners attention or instructions included with the towball fitting. This is not the case in my experience. I have also seen no mention in Caravan Club literature.

scanner · Post by **scanner** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:51 am

Bumbly1 wrote:Surely the load rating is the critical one not the plies? As long as the Bongo load rating is met (or exceeded) then it should be okay. I am surprised that no-one has mentioned road holding as that was the reason for me using car type tyres. Van tyres are often hard rubber compounds for high mileage which does not give as good a grip.

I don't know, ask a (good) tyre fitter?

It could be to do with safety margins if something does fail - more plies more safety margin perhaps?

Bumbly1 wrote:Multiple plies can also give a stiffer and harsher ride leading to extra noise and less "feel".

Seeing as how low profile (particularly ultra low profile tyres) have stiffer sidewalls in order to give better response and feed back surely this is a non sequitur?

i.e.

Many ultra high performance tyres also use fabric or steel cord reinforced sidewalls to increase steering response and cornering stability.

Soggy tyres = Soggy handling.

Bumbly1 · Post by **Bumbly1** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 11:33 am

scanner wrote:
Bumbly1 wrote:Surely the load rating is the critical one not the plies? As long as the Bongo load rating is met (or exceeded) then it should be okay. I am surprised that no-one has mentioned road holding as that was the reason for me using car type tyres. Van tyres are often hard rubber compounds for high mileage which does not give as good a grip.
I don't know, ask a (good) tyre fitter?

I did

scanner wrote: It could be to do with safety margins if something does fail - more plies more safety margin perhaps?

Ask a tyre fitter.

scanner wrote:
Bumbly1 wrote:Multiple plies can also give a stiffer and harsher ride leading to extra noise and less "feel".
Seeing as how low profile (particularly ultra low profile tyres) have stiffer sidewalls in order to give better response and feed back surely this is a non sequitur?

Apples and pears? Profiles/plies

scanner wrote: i.e.
Many ultra high performance tyres also use fabric or steel cord reinforced sidewalls to increase steering response and cornering stability.
Soggy tyres = Soggy handling.

There is a trade off between comfort and roadholding

scanner · Post by **scanner** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 12:52 pm

Bumbly1 wrote:I did

And what was his explanation?

Apples and pears? Profiles/plies

But same end result -a stiffer side wall, just different routes to the same end point.

There is a trade off between comfort and roadholding

That's not the same as what you said earlier, you never mentioned comfort then only "feel".

IF (I emphasise the IF as I don't know the answer as yet) Bongos should be fitted with reinforced or "van" tyres and non reinforced car tyres are fitted an offence would have been committed under the Construction and Use Regulations.
IF (I emphasise the IF once again) that were the case AND the use was revealed in an accident investigation AND proved to be a contributory factor the vehicle's insurance could be declared invalid.

I admit there is no mention of "reinforced" on the spec plate where the tyre sizes are listed but then the Bongo was never officially imnported into the UK and the C&U regulation do not apply in Japan there wouldn't be would there?.

Many on here have commented on the apparent unsuitability of Japanese tyre specs to UK roads and the general concensus on the desirabilty of Continental Vanco tyres suggests that use a "van" tyre has some advantages.

All I can say is that several tyre fitters I've spoken to have indicated their reluctance to fit "common or garden" car tyres to vehicles LIKE the Bongo.

I shall be undertaking some detailed research in the lead up to replacing the undersized 195s that were on the rear on my Bongo when I bought it, before I make my decision.

Next time I'm near the local independent tyre expert, I'm just going to show him the spec plate, ask what he recommends and why?

roosteruk · Post by **roosteruk** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 5:38 pm

Bumbly1 wrote:
And the basis for that is?

Safety and Peace of mind.
Van tyres have very little side movement, which will also help to cut down snaking.
I have a 23ft caravan and it was a pleasure to tow it with my Bongo.

trevd01 · Post by **trevd01** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 6:09 pm

I understand the Yokohamas we have were specified by Yokohama in the UK as the best tyres in their range for the Bongo (and they have proper van tyres in their range, too). This was done with full knowledge of the weight and speed of the vehicle.

scanner · Post by **scanner** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 7:06 pm

roosteruk wrote:
Bumbly1 wrote:
And the basis for that is?
Safety and Peace of mind.
Van tyres have very little side movement, which will also help to cut down snaking.
I have a 23ft caravan and it was a pleasure to tow it with my Bongo.

and when towing something like that, nose weight is the least of your problems.

trevd01 · Post by **trevd01** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 7:41 pm

I'm moving this to 'techie'

Mr Halibut · Post by **Mr Halibut** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 9:07 pm

You can pull a 23 foot caravan with a ford galaxy or a large family car and they don't need van tyres.

I would of thought van tyres were need for high loads i.e if you filling it full of house bricks and unwashed builders. A BMW 7 series is close to 2 ton which isn't a million miles away from a bongo, in fact most variants are lighter then this.

roosteruk · Post by **roosteruk** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:04 pm

I chose to have Van tyres fitted.....my choice.....I feel safer....I have piece of mind....I feel my family are safer, car full of kids, big caravan, loads of luggage, I feel safer than a Galaxy with all that weight and I used to have a Galaxy, I know what I feel safer in.

Jeez

Socket Set Sue · Post by **Socket Set Sue** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:11 pm

I agree with roosteruk, having the 'proper tyres' gives me a peace of mind and a my sense of duty to other road users has been fulfilled.

I have Continental Vancos all round on my 2WD, and YES the correct ones front and rear. If you fail to fit the correct tyres, and I mean the tyres as specified in the handbook you are asking for trouble.

Front 195/70 R 15 92S, Rear 215/65 R 15 96 S

The R means reinforced and the S is the load rating. Mention this to your Tyre 'Expert' at your local tyre shop and if he doesn't know what it means then go elsewhere, never accept ' these will do'.

A few words of wisdom have stuck in my mind for the last 15 - 20 years, they were:- 'If you can't afford to put the proper tyres on your car then you can't afford to run it'. Don't go for cheapest, think of yourself, your family and other road users, I imagine the Bongo is a very dangerous machine when its out of control.

scanner · Post by **scanner** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:29 pm

The other saying used to be.

"That's not well shod - that's well shoddy"

smartmonkey · Post by **smartmonkey** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:08 pm

I am afraid there isn't a definative answer for this one. Van tyres and car tyres have their pros and cons. The Bongo really isn't that heavy at 1700kg, I have had quite a few cars heavier than that.

Van tyres are like car tyres - a good quality tyre will be safer and more reliable than a cheapy. Car tyres will tend to have more ultimate grip and this is good when braking but possible bad when going round a corner. Van tyres will reduce swaying and be less inclined to punctures (and blowouts) and much better in snow. They will slightly increase stopping distances and give a poorer NVH. I feel good van tyres are the best compromise but that is based on the use I put my Bongo to. If you are going for van tyres be prepared to run higher than stock pressures.

At the end of the day get the best tyre you can afford of the right rating. Anything else is kind of irrelevant.

surfnut · Post by **surfnut** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:57 pm

posted this because having had my Bongo for about 6 months, the only thing I`m not happy about is the `swaying` that can just suddenly occur. She`s a 2WD Manual, and she came with 215s on the front, and 225s on the rear. I`ve yet to see anyone on here using that configuration. HAving read some other posts on here, I`m going to increase the air pressure in the tyres as a 1st step