Bongo head faults

ronhud · Post by **ronhud** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:11 pm

Thanks Mike. New thermostat fitted a week after purchase. Cooling system pressure tested. This by supplier - Elams of Huddersfield who seem knowledgeable. Thinking of fitting a Mason alarm in a week or two. I have heard that the oil filter change although scheduled at 3k miles is generally done at 6k instead - presumable based on modern oils being better? There are so many apparent reasons to spend money when you get a Bongo that realism has to enter somewhere!

Still interested to obtain list of work that should be carried out at main service interval.

Ron

dandywarhol · Post by **dandywarhol** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 2:19 pm

I think the Mason alarm is as good if not better than the engine block sensor readout.
It also recalibrates the gauge to give an accurate reading opposed to the approximation that the original gives so any malfunction in the system which would cause the coolant to overheat (coolant loss, radiator choked, fan malfunction, thermostat failure etc.) is instantly shown on the gauge and the alarm sounds.

Coupled to the Haydn low level alarm, you then have everything covered

dandywarhol · Post by **dandywarhol** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:15 pm

There isn't an issue with the original temp sensor IMO - the problem is in the dead spot on the gauge. When the mason alarm is fitted you can actually see how sensitive and accurate the original sensor is - the needle now flickers at the slightest change in temperature. With the alarm setup correctly then it will sound as soon as any irregularity is reached in the coolant temperature. It is REALLY sensitive.

haydn callow · Post by **haydn callow** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 11:05 pm

I thought there was a LOT more than 3000 Bongos running around U.K.
Still whatever the number I would guess 99% of them run around quite happily with no cooling problems. It's like anything else ...you only get the bad news.
I understood there was in excess of 10,000 Bongos in U.K.
Remember that most Bongo owners either have not heard of this site or are not interested.
There carn't be much wrong with the way a Bongo works co's loads of them have high mileage, even "dare I say" some of the supposedly low mileage ones.

Manny · Post by **Manny** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 3:22 pm

I have both in my Bongo. My thinking is that probably the most likely cause of overheating in an old vehicle is probably loss of coolant caused by old rubber hoses or head gasket or other leaks, but overheating could also be cuased by loss of circulation of coolant like blocked rediator, faulty thermostat etc. in which case the Mason alarm should come into its own. The Mason alarm does not have a sensor of its own, it relies on the original temperature sensor. It just makes the temp gauge respond more accurately by overcoming the damping of the gauge and also has an alarm which can be adjusted to go off at a certain temp. point.
For me its belt and braces to cover different overheating scenarios.

Manny

mikeonb4c · Post by **mikeonb4c** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 4:52 pm

Manny wrote:I have both in my Bongo. My thinking is that probably the most likely cause of overheating in an old vehicle is probably loss of coolant caused by old rubber hoses or head gasket or other leaks, but overheating could also be cuased by loss of circulation of coolant like blocked rediator, faulty thermostat etc. in which case the Mason alarm should come into its own. The Mason alarm does not have a sensor of its own, it relies on the original temperature sensor. It just makes the temp gauge respond more accurately by overcoming the damping of the gauge and also has an alarm which can be adjusted to go off at a certain temp. point.
For me its belt and braces to cover different overheating scenarios.

Manny

I'm coming round to what Dandy (and now you) are saying. But someone tell me I'm not mad (deathly silence) - the mason Alarm would be stuffed if there were no coolant around the sensor. But I (finally) get the point i.e. that would only happen in practice if there was a loss of coolant and in that case Haydn's low coolant alarm would have gone off. Think I may buy myself a Mason alarm at some point.

dandywarhol · Post by **dandywarhol** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 5:45 pm

The Mason alarm wouldn't be stuffed because the coolant would overheat immediately there was loss which would trigger the alarm even though you missed the rising gauge. But you are right about missing the rising gauge - when ever the temp sensor is out of coolant it will start to lower as it's reading (and not understanding) the temp of the air around it.
IMO the alarm will have sounded well before that - on the gauge's way up to "H"

Maybe the inventor could step in here for a few words..............

the-bongo-mongo · Post by **the-bongo-mongo** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 6:29 pm

i have to say, i have one which i got for a friend(although he may fall out with me soon when he gets a 800 quid bill) as i import jap cars but never a bongo..i read up a little and drove this one and was great for 20 mins(which i thought was enough to test any engine...but no...it has since been diagnosed(although not done yet) with a knackered head gasket..i was told by the mechanic, dont bother with the old it will be cracked so sorted all the bits out...awaiting fitting and for it to be delivered. i cant wait to get rid of it now and feel really bad about his bill..he still has a van with a new head and because i got it for him at trade price, he still has a very cheap bongo 4wd auto freetop in excellent condition (4k otr max) ...so not all doom and gloom although, i personally will never own one for the reasons in this thread.... ive had a few delicas and apart from expansion bottles cracking(60 quid and does no damage) and some wee niggles...i much prefer them but are a different beast...the thought of a long distance camper with this issue doesnt attract me one bit which is a pity as its such a nice vehicle to drive /run !

vanvliet · Post by **vanvliet** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 8:57 pm

Re Delicas - -
What type of engine do they have and are they all / mostly ten year old imports ?

dandywarhol · Post by **dandywarhol** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 12:58 am

You'd need to buy a step on ebay to get up into one wee man....

vanvliet · Post by **vanvliet** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 9:40 am

Had a look on the Delica forum . Not Bongo like dramas on their aging imports but they seem to have had a few problems with blocked rads Seems that they are having them rebuilt with larger diameter pipes. Worth having a gander at the site

Dave Mason · Post by **Dave Mason** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 4:13 pm

dandywarhol wrote:The Mason alarm wouldn't be stuffed because the coolant would overheat immediately there was loss which would trigger the alarm even though you missed the rising gauge... Maybe the inventor could step in here for a few words...

All sounds very familiar. We had this debate on the Townace forum 5 years ago! Reminds me of that book "Zen and the art of motorcycle maintenace" - there are so many ways of looking at the subject.

Another factor with imports is that when a new model starts arriving, say the Estima, at first they will be the best examples because no-one will risk buying anything else. Once they build up a good reputation the demand increases and the importers are tempted to bring in worse and worse examples because they all sell like hot cakes.

Cooling system alarms will do two things - they will forewarn you if part of the system is gradually deteriorating, and they will finally warn you if there is a crisis. What you must remember is that they are not a substitute for maintenance. Personally I don't go the "design fault" route. These are unconventional vehicles but their design teams are not stupid. I would always prefer to maintain it the way it was built rather than think I can improve it.

the-bongo-mongo · Post by **the-bongo-mongo** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 5:24 pm

fuel economy isn't a word best associated with delicas or shoguns unfortunately...50 miles for a tenner i would say....mine cost me 1700 otr as i sell these types of imports but would retail at around 3000-4000 although i sold this one cheaper at 2700 two days after registering it for a quick buck ! ....it was a late 95m reg with 133klms and was mint !!! i can get these to order quite easily and would sell cheaper if i was buying one with someone elses cash on a pre-order basis !

vanvliet · Post by **vanvliet** » Wed Dec 26, 2007 10:17 pm

unconventional vehicles but their design teams are not stupid. I would always prefer to maintain it the way it was built rather than think I can improve it.[/quote]

Nobody said that the design teams were 'stupid' but they are not infallible either and it is plain 'daft ' to suggest this .
So , I will be improving the system they designed by fitting two alarms and a set of silicon pipes.
The motor industry has a long history of technical blunders .Look at the number of recalls .
The Delica forum makes comments about the use of small bore pipes in the design of their radiators being a possible reason for crud build up and coolant system failure.
Time we put this one to bed for the present and just wait to see how it all pans out .

The Great Pretender · Post by **The Great Pretender** » Thu Dec 27, 2007 12:40 am

vanvliet wrote:unconventional vehicles but their design teams are not stupid. I would always prefer to maintain it the way it was built rather than think I can improve it.

Nobody said that the design teams were 'stupid' but they are not infallible either and it is plain 'daft ' to suggest this .
So , I will be improving the system they designed by fitting two alarms and a set of silicon pipes.
The motor industry has a long history of technical blunders .Look at the number of recalls .
The Delica forum makes comments about the use of small bore pipes in the design of their radiators being a possible reason for crud build up and coolant system failure.
Time we put this one to bed for the present and just wait to see how it all pans out .[/quote]

The 'design team' design, accountants decide what is built and thats where the problem is. IMHO