Glowplugs ?

[Northern Bongolow]

it sounds like you have the cable out of adjustment somewhere, or the diaphram opererated linkages, operated via the solenoids. these new plugs were poss ok, but did you test them first. and did you test the old ones you took out.
if you follow the line from the throttle cable adjuster to the end of the throttle cable the end comes to rest on a brass coloured ball type plunger thingy, it has 2 wires going to it that run forward towards the belts.

if someone could post a lushy pic i could give you the part number to locate its position.
to be honest i dont know what it is or what its called, but it must be pushed in when on rest/tickover, and let out when running.

[M 80NGO]

it sounds like you have the cable out of adjustment somewhere, or the diaphram opererated linkages, operated via the solenoids. these new plugs were poss ok, but did you test them first. and did you test the old ones you took out.
if you follow the line from the throttle cable adjuster to the end of the throttle cable the end comes to rest on a brass coloured ball type plunger thingy, it has 2 wires going to it that run forward towards the belts.

if someone could post a lushy pic i could give you the part number to locate its position.
to be honest i dont know what it is or what its called, but it must be pushed in when on rest/tickover, and let out when running.

Thanx buddy thats a fairly good description of what i need to look for, yes i checked the plugs whilst in the rail on my bench prior to fitting with the aid of a jump pack and they're all glowing, the old ones were also glowing when i tested them but as this cured the problem 18 months ago i just assumed ( ASS out of U and ME ) that they were weakening, leave it with me i will triumphant and not beaten by the lumpy smokey start up gremlin that has temporarily possesed my beautiful l'oreal

[Northern Bongolow]

to be honest i used to test mine like that, just hold them in pliers on my battery, but i found it wasnt a good enough test, you need to measure the resistance properly. it should be 0.9 of an ohm at 20 degc (room temp).
they could still glow but not at the correct rate.
simply get an ameter, set it to ohms and put the red to the centre top and the black to the body of the plug, you can do the same test while still in the head if you take off the connecting rail.

[dandywarhol]

Right it hasn't cured the problem so its back to the drawing board, i spoke to the technical dept a a very well regarded Bongo dealer who told me that the cold start mechanism needs activating by depressing the throttle prior to start up, so i tried this method at home time and it made no differance.

she fires up and runs fine until you can hear a solenoid "click" then she starts chuffin out unburnt fuel so i'm thinkin that there must be either a cold start solenoid / run on valve / relay thats not doing what it should do, as soon as it starts missing and i raise the revs she runs fine. where do i look next ?

Techi having a laff M8 - cold start operation doesn't need to have the foot depressed. Old fashioned Di engines started better on full throttle when Albions were all the rage

[M 80NGO]

Right it hasn't cured the problem so its back to the drawing board, i spoke to the technical dept a a very well regarded Bongo dealer who told me that the cold start mechanism needs activating by depressing the throttle prior to start up, so i tried this method at home time and it made no differance.

she fires up and runs fine until you can hear a solenoid "click" then she starts chuffin out unburnt fuel so i'm thinkin that there must be either a cold start solenoid / run on valve / relay thats not doing what it should do, as soon as it starts missing and i raise the revs she runs fine. where do i look next ?

Techi having a laff M8 - cold start operation doesn't need to have the foot depressed. Old fashioned Di engines started better on full throttle when Albions were all the rage

Well i didn't think the pedal had to be depressed either but when your talking to a very well regarded Bongo specialist you tend to take it as read that they know what they're on about and tbh they've always given good assistance in the past, so its back to my investigations, the little plunger is being depressed when the van is off coldstart, would fuel pump timing be an issue ? The annoying thing is that once i've manually upped the revs she clears and runs fine on her warm up cycle is there a secondary relay for the glowplugs for once the first relay has clicked off or is it all controlled via the one relay ?

[teenmal]

Right it hasn't cured the problem so its back to the drawing board, i spoke to the technical dept a a very well regarded Bongo dealer who told me that the cold start mechanism needs activating by depressing the throttle prior to start up, so i tried this method at home time and it made no differance.

she fires up and runs fine until you can hear a solenoid "click" then she starts chuffin out unburnt fuel so i'm thinkin that there must be either a cold start solenoid / run on valve / relay thats not doing what it should do, as soon as it starts missing and i raise the revs she runs fine. where do i look next ?

Techi having a laff M8 - cold start operation doesn't need to have the foot depressed. Old fashioned Di engines started better on full throttle when Albions were all the rage

Well i didn't think the pedal had to be depressed either but when your talking to a very well regarded Bongo specialist you tend to take it as read that they know what they're on about and tbh they've always given good assistance in the past, so its back to my investigations, the little plunger is being depressed when the van is off coldstart, would fuel pump timing be an issue ? The annoying thing is that once i've manually upped the revs she clears and runs fine on her warm up cycle is there a secondary relay for the glowplugs for once the first relay has clicked off or is it all controlled via the one relay ?

Hi the glow plugs should remain active until the engine heats up,they are controlled by the ECU/the 2 wire temp transmitter and the TPS.

Cheers.

[dandywarhol]

Pump timing doesn't change - unless someone changes it - unlikely to be your problem.

The solenoid is controlled by the centre coolant sensor as teenmal says AND turbo boost - check there's no turbo pipe come adrift - the tiny pipes I mean - not the ones the coola.........................nah - just yankin' yer chain...................

From memory, there's a small turbo boost pipe appears around the front of the cylinder head and goes to the turbo boost diaphragm on the pump and (I think) to the solenoids at the back of the head.

[Northern Bongolow]

i think teenmal has nailed it.
check the temp sensor and the wiring to it. its just under the glow plugs and the solenoids, so you will have knocked/broken it when you were doing the glowplugs.
its at the driverside rear of the cylinder head (under no3-4 glowplug), if you move the solenoids to one side to get at the rear plugs you can fracture the temp switch end, see if the end wobbles, or that the wires are intact, or the grey plastic connector is broken, push it on a bit as the securing clip breaks with the heat.
any bad connection here gives mixed restistance readings so cocks up the glow plug on/off timings etc.

[M 80NGO]

Thats great info guys and it will be my next investigation, one other thing that popped in my head today was the 2 pipes that come off of the actuator / plunger housing one from the middle and one from the end of the unit then run up to the longish metal pipes that go behind the inlet manifold to the solenoids which way round should these be plumbed it ? should the one at the back of the unit to the rear pipe and the one from the middle to the front pipe or t'other way round ?

[M 80NGO]

Had a conversation with the dealer who i bought l'oreal off of today and he mentioned the fuel pump timing, surely if it was fuel pump timing then it would have issues all the time not just when its stone cold.

The water temp sensor is all intact and not broken either wiring or connectors so i'm thinking that it may well be the temp sensor its self as the problem only occurs when the engine / coolant is stone cold ie the temp sensor is not telling the ecu that the coolant is stone cold, is the part available at a local motor factors and if so does anyone know the part number ?

Thanx, pete.

[dandywarhol]

Pete - Ask your dealer how the pump timing can "go out" because unless the securing nuts have all loosened off (highly unlikely) or teeth have stripped of the drive gear (again highly unlikely) then the pump timing stays exactly where it was when the engine was built.

[jaylee]

Pete, you don't/didn't have one of those "winter pack" northern Japan cold start jobbies fitted do you....

I have a possible comment to make about the.....

vacuum solenoids too, & this "actuator injection pump"..? http://lushprojects.com/bongopartsmk2/c ... o=.html#18



plus the adjustment of 24-173A


but don't want to cover old ground on that one..!!! (Ady!!?)

I will ask are you sure both vacuum solenoids are working & all hose work is intact.. No hose connectors broken off the solenoids???

[M 80NGO]

Pete, you don't/didn't have one of those "winter pack" northern Japan cold start jobbies fitted do you....

I have a possible comment to make about the.....

vacuum solenoids too, & this "actuator injection pump"..? http://lushprojects.com/bongopartsmk2/c ... o=.html#18



plus the adjustment of 24-173A


but don't want to cover old ground on that one..!!! (Ady!!?)

I will ask are you sure both vacuum solenoids are working & all hose work is intact.. No hose connectors broken off the solenoids???

DWH, the pump was taken off back in the summer by a local garage when the internal shaft seal let go, the pump was removed sent off complete reseal and then refitted once the TPS was set up she ran fine until just recently so i'm fairly sure its not a pump timing issue i was just throwing it out there to get some feedback.

Jaylee yes she is a northern girl complete with winter pack but i never use it, its like the pics you posted up with solenoids and actuator, all the pipes are in good condition a couple have been replaced at some point with what looks like fuel hose rubber internal with cloth braided outer

Got home at 15:30 s'afternoon run her down and shut her off then went back out at 19:30 and fired her up she started straight away as nomal but she only had a very slight misfire which to me points to a link with the coolant temp.

[jaylee]

Jaylee yes she is a northern girl complete with winter pack but i never use it, its like the pics you posted up with solenoids and actuator, all the pipes are in good condition a couple have been replaced at some point with what looks like fuel hose rubber internal with cloth braided outer

Got home at 15:30 s'afternoon run her down and shut her off then went back out at 19:30 and fired her up she started straight away as nomal but she only had a very slight misfire which to me points to a link with the coolant temp.

Mmm, i know very little about the "winter pack" ,but i have read things (valves) stick & the van can run a little rough...
Don't quote me but normally this phenomenon happens when hot...?

Mines from the saufff.! I got mine to tick over at a constant 750.. Either on cold start to when warmed up, or when the solenoids activated when the AC is on... Even in the brassic weather were having now, i don't need no throttle to start "clear the throat".. I just wait for the plug light to go out & start.. It idles lovely!
In fact, i tend to let the vehicle warm up ticking over at 750 not wishing to put undue stress on a freezing cold engine....
Even in the summer driving only till it's "locked up" gearbox wise do i really give it the beans...!

Hope this helps?

[jaylee]

I'll throw this in the mix too... http://www.igmaynard.co.uk/bongo/forum/ ... m+solenoid