Leisure Battery and Hook Up Technical Question

[Mini Men]

Hi

Planning to fit a Leisure Battery and Hook up to our unconverted Bongo. Couple of wiring questions I'm not sure of.

Proposing not to fit a split charge relay as I want to charge the Leisure from Solar and it seemed complicated, I will therefore have two separate DC systems in the van, again does this cause a problem on DC earthing.

1. Should I run a negative wire from the neg leisure battery terminal to the rear DC Cig lighter/lights I am fitting or just connect the negative locally to the chassis at the rear of the van. Leisure battery will be earthed in the bonnet.
2. On the AC side, should I earth the RCD/MCB box I am fitting inside locally to the chassis (not really earthed as van is not connected to the ground) (problem with DC already earthed to chassis) or use the Earth in the cable from the hook up and hope the campsite are earthed correctly.

Any help appreciated.

[bongojoe]

Proposing not to fit a split charge relay as I want to charge the Leisure from Solar and it seemed complicated, I will therefore have two separate DC systems in the van, again does this cause a problem on DC earthing.

It's not complicated to have a split charger and a solar charger - I have exactly that set up. In fact, it has advantages, because you can use the solar panel to keep the S/B charged up.

But no, you won't have an issue with the -ve being common to both batteries if the +ve terminals are never connected.

1. Should I run a negative wire from the neg leisure battery terminal to the rear DC Cig lighter/lights I am fitting or just connect the negative locally to the chassis at the rear of the van. Leisure battery will be earthed in the bonnet.

There's no need to. For my conversion, I have run a -ve cable back from L/B, but this is mainly for convenience so I'm not looking for places to connect to the chassis.

2. On the AC side, should I earth the RCD/MCB box I am fitting inside locally to the chassis (not really earthed as van is not connected to the ground) (problem with DC already earthed to chassis) or use the Earth in the cable from the hook up and hope the campsite are earthed correctly.

vvvv edit - what he said down below! vvvvv

[g8dhe]

There really isn't anything complicated about a Split Charge system for charging the L/B whilst the engine is running, infact its a lot simpler than what is hidden away in the Solar Panel charger!

1. There is no problem with earthing at all. Just connect the L/B -ve terminal via a thick cable to a local earth point just the same as the S/B.

You don't mention swapping any existing circuits over to run off the L/B however ???? Its common/normal to switch the Radio, Cab lights and sockets over and if you have electric blinds them as well. However if your not going to have a Split Charge system, you might want to think carefully about what might not work correctly if the L/B runs down over the winter period, the Cab lights fuse is also used to power other vehicle circuits like door lock, and backup power to the ECU and anything else requiring unswitched, permanent power connection.

2. Yes it is critical that the incoming Earth wire from the external EHU socket is earthed to the chassis of vehicle. All other metal boxes associated with the EHU must also be earthed to the chassis of the vehicle as well as any earth points on the RCD/MCB and sockets. To fully meet regulations (but not a legal necessity & I have NEVER seen any one do this!!) you are also meant to earth the chassis of the vehicle thru a ground stake, in most cases it just isn't practical to get a good enough earth stake into the ground at a campsite to do any good nor have I seen any sites provide suitable stakes on a pitch!

See here http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Book/7.9.2.htm para 9 regarding all metal parts and earthing.

[winchman]

2. Yes it is critical that the incoming Earth wire from the external EHU socket is earthed to the chassis of vehicle. All other metal boxes associated with the EHU must also be earthed to the chassis of the vehicle as well as any earth points on the RCD/MCB and sockets. To fully meet regulations (but not a legal necessity & I have NEVER seen any one do this!!) you are also meant to earth the chassis of the vehicle thru a ground stake, in most cases it just isn't practical to get a good enough earth stake into the ground at a campsite to do any good nor have I seen any sites provide suitable stakes on a pitch!

See here http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Book/7.9.2.htm para 9 regarding all metal parts and earthing.

Its surprising how many people don't bother but its vital as with no earth its just not safe and potentially lethal in the event of an electrical fault

[g8dhe]

Yup! Its also what worries me about bringing in an RCD protected block thru the tail gate, everybody assumes that because the sockets are protected by an RCD then all is fine .... the trouble is the RCD only protects AFTER the sockets and the most likely place for a cable fault to develop is when it gets damaged in the tailgate, with a Live touching the vehicle chassis, initially nothing happens, but then when someone steps out or in to the vehicle they get a belt between arm and leg - straight thru the heart muscles - you just have to hope the campsite RCD operates QUICK!!

[Dodgey]

Split charging relays are not complicated and they are worth having, even if you have solar - then you are covered even on overcast days.

They cost very little. All they are is a wire from each battery live, and an earth.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CAMPER-VAN-SP ... 258916cc4c

With solar, you can plumb the solar charger into the SB and then it'll charge both batteries. I however don't install them like this, and don't recommend it either. There just is no need. Your SB should never really need charging as you won't be using it when camping, you use your LB, and also, when the sun is out, you want all that lovely power going to your LB.

If you have a flat SB then you have problems elsewhere.

[Velocette]

If you are planning to run a fridge or anything power hungry from the rear 12V socket you should run a decent sized pair of wires as the original wiring is inadequate.

[Dodgey]

If you are planning to run a fridge or anything power hungry from the rear 12V socket you should run a decent sized pair of wires as the original wiring is inadequate.

Indeed - for a fridge you want the thickest wire you can afford - they draw a LOT more than their rated current each time the compressor starts - if your wire is not thick enough then the fridge will think your battery is too low and won't operate for nearly as long as it should do.

Best bet if you are creating a 2nd, LB DC circuit is to run a real chunky live to a dedicated fuse box, then run your devices from there.

[Jerzy]

I thought I wouldn’t start another thread…

The Bongo isn’t my daily drive so it’s stood quite a bit so I thought I’d get a charger in case of emergency, eg:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/CTEK-Multi-Func ... B004TLF4PC

I’ve already got a split charge thing for my SB & LB while I’m running.
So, can I hard-wire the CTEK in so that:

- The battery(s) recharge when camped on hook-up.
- I can recharge the battery(s) at home by plugging in the hookup rather than putting the charger on with the croc clips under the bonnet.

Thanks.

[briwy]

Yup! Its also what worries me about bringing in an RCD protected block thru the tail gate, everybody assumes that because the sockets are protected by an RCD then all is fine .... the trouble is the RCD only protects AFTER the sockets and the most likely place for a cable fault to develop is when it gets damaged in the tailgate, with a Live touching the vehicle chassis, initially nothing happens, but then when someone steps out or in to the vehicle they get a belt between arm and leg - straight thru the heart muscles - you just have to hope the campsite RCD operates QUICK!!

That's why, as you have mentioned before Geoff, it's a good idea to use something like this in the cable near the plug into the power supply.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/In-Line-RCD-C ... 4897.l4275

[mikexgough]

I thought I wouldn’t start another thread…

The Bongo isn’t my daily drive so it’s stood quite a bit so I thought I’d get a charger in case of emergency, eg:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/CTEK-Multi-Func ... B004TLF4PC

I’ve already got a split charge thing for my SB & LB while I’m running.
So, can I hard-wire the CTEK in so that:

- The battery(s) recharge when camped on hook-up.
- I can recharge the battery(s) at home by plugging in the hookup rather than putting the charger on with the croc clips under the bonnet.

Thanks.

I have a lidl ctek alike charger built into my Bongo.... I also have the "Willinton" split charge unit...now this VSR split charge...will I found during charging on hook up charge both batteries...

I have wired the charger direct to the LB...and the SB also gets a charge via the Split kit

I don't use it much these days as I have gone solar with one of the excellent kits from member Dodgey...but will as soon as it arrives have a solar split charge unit which will ...when the LB is full ...push the solar generated power to the SB...

[Jerzy]

So is it just a case of wiring the mains input of the charger to my incoming hookup and running the charger wires to the leisure battery terminals or do I need any fuses anywhere ?

[g8dhe]

Wire the mains side to the an unused outlet on the small consumer unit if possible, or at least on the consumer side of the RCD and isolation switch.
You also need fuses close to the battery connection, the Ctek will have internal fuses to protect its own wiring, but which ever batteries it connects to have a suitable fuse rated for the wiring as close to the battery as possible.