Flashing glow plug and loss of power

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samuel
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Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by samuel » Sun Nov 05, 2017 7:16 pm

We recently purchased a 2001 fly by wire 2.5TD 4WD which quite soon after gave us a flashing glow plug light accompanied with a loss of power. This seems to be quite a problem in post 2000 diesel models. I thought I had bought a pup as this problem just wouldn't go away and was steadily getting more frequent. Oddly enough although I have owned another Bongo for 13 years I didn't realise how different the turbo arrangement was! The Mk1 is so much simpler. The Mk3 has clearly been modified for better emissions but at the same time is much more complicated using a variable vane turbo controlled by a vacuum system and a mixture of control valves.

I have searched the site for solutions but have found much confusing information.

This therefore is an account of what I personally did to my Bongo which seems to have solved the problem on my Bongo. It may not work for your Bongo but is a very simple and cheap solution which might work in conjunction with other members inputs.

There are many vacuum pipes both sides of the engine bay which over the years have lost their ability to provide a tight seal on the various components which could lead to a loss of vacuum. I pulled each pipe off and found the majority had an internal diameter twice that of what they should have and therefore were very easy to remove. With a very sharp knife I managed to trim most of the pipes by about 8mm and push them back tight on the components. Where the tubes couldn't be trimmed I bought some vacuum hose from Halfords with an internal diameter of 3.2mm.

All this lot controls the actuator which moves up and down to adjust the variable vanes inside the turbo casing. It's also worth removing the circlip and pin linking the actuator and making sure everything moves freely. A pair of pliers will be required to pull the actuator up and down as it is spring assisted. As long as this moves up and down you should have a fully functioning turbo along with a vacuum retaining system.
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Northern Bongolow
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by Northern Bongolow » Sun Nov 05, 2017 7:51 pm

nice job, it pays to go through the basics first as it could as you suspected just be a pipe off or split, a variable vane turbo does require a periodic clean out as they can carbon up inside, a fuel system cleaner and egr/ turbo cleaner does the trick if done often enough.
samuel
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by samuel » Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:53 pm

Yes I use Archoil diesel additive every now and then to clean the turbo and other internal bits. I think it is worth doing having had a Citroen Relay EGR failure. The amount of carbon build up was beyond belief. The amount of black smoke coming out was embarrassing. Got sorted obviously but I reckon a regular addition of an additive may have prevented all that carbon build up.
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Northern Bongolow
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by Northern Bongolow » Sun Nov 05, 2017 10:30 pm

sounds like your all over it mate. =D> =D> =D>
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by Bob » Sun Nov 05, 2017 10:38 pm

Yep, really useful for others, thanks. 8)
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by Ian » Sun Nov 05, 2017 11:42 pm

samuel wrote: Sun Nov 05, 2017 7:16 pmI have searched the site for solutions but have found much confusing information.
Thanks for the updated info. The stuff we have about the turbo/actuator etc is summarized in the "Wastegate" fact sheet in the members area of the main website so I will make sure it is updated.
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samuel
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by samuel » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:48 pm

Thanks Ian
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stuffy
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by stuffy » Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:22 pm

I've no wish to hijack your thread Samuel but I have a similar issue.

Mine has been doing this (an even flash, one second on one second off) intermittently for about a year now and have just learn't to live with it! The power drops when the light comes on and it struggles up hills, towing becomes 'difficult'.

When the glow plug light doesn't flash, the van whizzes along with heaps of power. This suggests to me that nothing is wrong with the turbo and the vanes are doing what the vanes doo. How would turbo cleaner help as it seems to function so well? I ask this because I have just bought some 2-part cleaner to try but I'm not convinced it will help.

Now to add insult, the 'hold light' has started flashing at me as well? Wish I'd kept our older (1996) reliable Bongo rather than going for the newer 2002 Aero, its been nothing but trouble!

I need Help! . . . . . . . . Northern Bongolow - Vanessa, any advise?
samuel
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by samuel » Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:00 pm

Hi Vanessa

You're not hijacking my thread. Sorry to hear of your woes and to be honest I still suffer the occasional loss of power although its not as bad as it was.

I have found now that carrying a pair of long nose plier's comes in handy. What I have found is that if I lift the passenger seat I can get to the wastegate actuator rod on the turbo. It is situated in a gap on the heat shield of the turbo. It has a threaded section. I simply grip the rod and move it up and down a few times and this gets the turbo working again.

I am trying to source a new actuator as I am hoping that will be a cure all.

I hope this helps. Like you I had a 1995 Bongo. I still own it! I have never had a problem like this with it as it is quite different.
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by Bob » Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:33 pm

Welcome Stuffy. 8)

And do ask anything you want on here, we have a great team and a lot of real world experience. :wink:
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by Northern Bongolow » Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:12 am

this is the easy non removal way of cleaning the bongo turbo and egr valve. you may have to repeat a few times to break down the carbon build up, use the proper stuff is my tip, egr and or turbo cleaner.
if you remove the turbo or egr you can use oven cleaner as on the net, but i wouldnt use this while its still on the car,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZDsdM571_M.

this vid shows the internals of the turbo and what needs cleaning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o1Hvt2b7PL0

the above presumes that the vac pipes are ok and that the diaphragm unit is ok. the egr has a position switch on the top, this switch must also be removed/cleaned /tested. this sends the message to the ecu to say whether its moving or not.
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by cutlass » Tue Jan 16, 2018 3:01 pm

stuffy - at first - read flash-codes! NOTE - I think on you bongo - that is 4 - digits!!!!! and after 09/2001 year on bongo instal turbo-charger without "westgate" - on you bongo 2002 year may be instal only "Variable Geometry Turbine" - it work from "vacum pump" and use signal from ECU.....more offen dont work right MAP-sensor (install at inlet plastic pipe at front engine - OEM KJ0118211A) or pipe of vacum valves.....
samuel
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by samuel » Wed May 16, 2018 10:13 pm

Firstly thank you to Anton for his recent input regarding the issue of flashing glow plug light and loss of power. I have suffered this problem for quite a while and inputted earlier my findings but unfortunately the problem came back. Anton gave us resistance figures for the solenoids and this inspired me to get my multimeter out.

I'm going start from scratch in the hope that this may help others with a similar problem.

Symptom - Flashing glow plug light with loss of power when engine appears to get to normal operating temperature.

Vehicle is a 2001 2500 TD.

First check the wastegate actuator rod by lifting it up and down with a pair of pliers. You will feel resistance as it is spring loaded. Should go up and down. Disconnect the rod to the turbo. This should be free to move up and down. If it doesn't move it means the turbo will need decoking.
Check all vacuum pipes are a tight fit on their respective components under both the drivers and passengers seats.
Next use a multimeter to check the resistance across each solenoid. 2 under the passenger seat and 4 under the drivers seat. This where I found the problem. Anton mentioned that the solenoids under the drivers seat are subject to a lot of dirt. Oh how right he is!
Use a multimeter and measure the resistance across each solenoid 30-60 Ohms (1 or zero ohms change solenoid). However I found that two of the solenoids under the drivers seat were filthy and registering 0 ohms across the connectors. I cleaned the connectors with a flat needle file and hey presto got the required resistance measurement. I also heated the solenoids to 80C to check that I still got a resistance. All was fine.
There is a one-way valve under the drivers seat which can also be checked but don't try and remove the pipes from it as it is quite fragile. Instead pull a hose from its nearest solenoid. Suck and blow to check it works.

I have since covered a few hundred miles and the Bongo is running absolutely brilliantly. Before I would cover less than two miles and the symptoms would raise their ugly heads.

The resistance figures above are supplied by Anton (metalhead).

I hope those of you suffering a similar problem will find this useful as practically these are very simple checks. Having said that I have been inspired by Anton to make checks I may have overlooked.
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metalhead
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by metalhead » Thu May 17, 2018 4:18 pm

Check error code
Post error code
samuel
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Re: Flashing glow plug and loss of power

Post by samuel » Thu May 17, 2018 9:34 pm

Hi Anton

I will. I tried to get the codes but the wire I was using was too thick to insert into the diagnostic port!!

Sourcing thin wire so will be back very soon.
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