DEBATE: Can LB be charged using 240v charger working off SB

[mikeonb4c]

Great info maxi_77 and thanks. It sounds then like there is no real way (from what you are saying) of getting a full charge into an LB using onboard systems alone and given the typical Bongo lifestyle. A pity, because taking the LB out on a regular basis is not really practical option for me. If only there were a way through (or should that be 'round') this impasse (solar panels perhaps?).

[Shaun_E]

All voltage measurements were done the next day so at least 12 hours had elapsed. I am using a good quality digital multimeter so have no reason to disbelieve the measurements.
I don't know that the split charge is regulated so I will now measure the voltage drops at different points in the wiring as suggested - it could well be poor wiring.
I also now need to check the battery fluid levels (if I can - I didn't notice whether it was sealed or not!) and then see what happens when I charge it completely with the smart charger. If it doesn't hold it's charge then a new battery could solve most of the problems.
Thanks for all the ideas so far.

[g8dhe]

it was ~13.8V so my split charging circuit is voltage regulated and will never charge the LB fully.

Do you know that you have a regulated system ? There not that common, and its very easy to get a voltage drop between all the connections and fuses such that you won't see the full charging voltage. Another point is where exactly are you measuring the battery voltage and what sort of meter is it that your measuring it with ?

I would suggest that if its a reasonable meter, that you measure the voltage drop starting from the S/B +ve terminal down thru the first fuse and to the split charge relay/module, then again on the otherside of the relay and down to the second fuse next to the L/B. Its also a good idea to check that you have a good earth connection and that there is minimal voltage drop (less than 0.1 volts) when drawing a load (say 2-4 amps) between the -ve of each battery and the chassis of the vehicle.

Ah just realised your NOT talking about a regulated Split-charge setup but a regulated charger hanging off your EHU in addition to the Split Charger from one of your previous posts ?
In this case you need to adjust your EHU charger for the correct voltage to charge the L/B when on a hook-up for the way you use your L/B, this may vary from only a Mtce. charge typically 1-2 Amps charging current to keep the battery topped up, to a full charge scenario where you need 14.4Volts to ensure that you get the full charge into the battery over 24-48 hours.

Using a 3-phase/stage charger is fine (provided its not one that you tell it the capacity of the battery) provided it can supply the required current for the first Stage of charging (typically 6-12 Amps), these will work even if you have extra loads on the battery whilst its charging (programmable ones that need to know the capacity won't work in this situation).

[maxi_77]

Great info maxi_77 and thanks. It sounds then like there is no real way (from what you are saying) of getting a full charge into an LB using onboard systems alone and given the typical Bongo lifestyle. A pity, because taking the LB out on a regular basis is not really practical option for me. If only there were a way through (or should that be 'round') this impasse (solar panels perhaps?).

The problem is that getting the last 10% in with any charger takes time. I did have a boat where the batteries were kept topped up by a low output wind generator which worked well. The solar charger will probably not do that badly though I wouldn't put that much faith in the little one you put on the dasboard, equally anything more than about 15 watts will need a regulator to deal with excess charging power. All in all I would suggest you do not need to go for a full top up of the LB all that often, shame the good old days when you could actually get your garage to charge your battery or even the local accumulator station are gone.

[mikeonb4c]

Great info maxi_77 and thanks. It sounds then like there is no real way (from what you are saying) of getting a full charge into an LB using onboard systems alone and given the typical Bongo lifestyle. A pity, because taking the LB out on a regular basis is not really practical option for me. If only there were a way through (or should that be 'round') this impasse (solar panels perhaps?).

The problem is that getting the last 10% in with any charger takes time. I did have a boat where the batteries were kept topped up by a low output wind generator which worked well. The solar charger will probably not do that badly though I wouldn't put that much faith in the little one you put on the dasboard, equally anything more than about 15 watts will need a regulator to deal with excess charging power. All in all I would suggest you do not need to go for a full top up of the LB all that often, shame the good old days when you could actually get your garage to charge your battery or even the local accumulator station are gone.

Indeed.

I'm thinking of a decent sized solar panel (say 60 watts, and with a regulator). As well as keeping the LB nicely topped up if the vehicle is not being driven much, it can make a useful contribution to lengthening power availability by assiting the LB when it is in use.

The solar panel cost would have to be borne of course, but what price time and convenience and freedom from a bad back.

[Yamaha]

I thought about 60w solar panels too, Mike, and when Maplins had them on offer recently. I splashed out for them. I had visions of fitting them on the AFT - but they weigh a ton!!

4 off, 15w each panel - and including the controller, I believe I paid about £180 by using the discount vouchers - but there's no way you could ever open the AFT with that lot on top - so, in keeping with a lot of my hairbrained schemes, they are still brand new, and in their (huge) box out in the conservatory - awaiting plan B !!!

Mike

[mikeonb4c]

I thought about 60w solar panels too, Mike, and when Maplins had them on offer recently. I splashed out for them. I had visions of fitting them on the AFT - but they weigh a ton!!

4 off, 15w each panel - and including the controller, I believe I paid about £180 by using the discount vouchers - but there's no way you could ever open the AFT with that lot on top - so, in keeping with a lot of my hairbrained schemes, they are still brand new, and in their (huge) box out in the conservatory - awaiting plan B !!!

Mike

Good heads-up there Yamaha, and I hadn't realised they were that heavy. My only thoughts are:

* Were these ones on offer as being older, more heavier spec than latest offerings
* Do we need 60w anyway if all we're trying to do is keep the LB fully charged during rest periods
* By mounting the panel right at the back of the roof, the strain should be minimised to the point (with luck) of being insignificant

So if you feel you can't use all the ones you have boxed up in the conservatory, and depending on weight etc., I know a man who might.......

[mikeonb4c]

Subject: DEBATE: Can LB be charged using 240v charger working off SB

I thought about 60w solar panels too, Mike, and when Maplins had them on offer recently. I splashed out for them. I had visions of fitting them on the AFT - but they weigh a ton!!

4 off, 15w each panel - and including the controller, I believe I paid about £180 by using the discount vouchers - but there's no way you could ever open the AFT with that lot on top - so, in keeping with a lot of my hairbrained schemes, they are still brand new, and in their (huge) box out in the conservatory - awaiting plan B !!!

Mike

Mike (Yamaha)

I meant to say that before you posted, I'd put this ebay item on my watchlist:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... K:MEWAX:IT

It doesn't sound too big, heavy or expensive, so what's the catch I'm wondering. I'd be interested if anyone has any thoughts

[mikexgough]

If I remember correctly BF member Corrur has solar panel(s) on his AFT..... not seen him on lately though...he does a fair bit of Wild camping in Scotland and the panels give him a top up charge

[Jaws]

Solar is definitely the way to go IMHO although it is still rather pricey.

To fully charge the LB you need (1) a voltage higher than that usually produced by the alternator and (2) a means of regulating this to suit the battery being charged and the state of charge.

Get a solar panel and suitable control unit and voila I fitted a 70w semi flexible panel (output about 20v) at the rear of the AFT linked via a controller to the Zig CF9. This keeps everything nicely charged including the SB via a two way VSR. Several days camping with the fridge running is no problem but park up facing North for best results

Solar panel controllers are designed to charge batteries as standard. And the energy is free. Of course if you keep the vehicle in a garage when not in use it's less effective...

[scanner]

Of course if you keep the vehicle in a garage when not in use it's less effective...

That depends..................

My garage hasn't got a roof at the moment.

[helen&tony]

Hi
Ah...with the accent on "Renewable Energy" as the new buzz-word in Bullshine, where every country is aiming towards lots of lovely cheap energy , why not lead the way...Every home should have a Rutland Wind Charger attached to the home for trickling the car batteries...yes...they DO work, and are popular in the boating world....perhaps we could go one better, and attach one to the Bongo roof!.....then again, with the English weather system, and its' propensity for chucking it down with the wet stuff, you can also add an old bathtub to the garage roof....Two would be better!....when full, a waste drain would open, cascading the water down to a reservoir at ground level, where a mini-turbine would run a generator to charge a battery with a few micro-volts....whoopee, we're well on the way to a self-sufficient battery. ....and fully in line with Governmental bullshine.....and with all the excess wind power generated from the wind turbine, you could pump the water back up to the bathtub(s) on a non-rainy day
What a wonderful world!
Cheers
Helen
P.S. I'm off crocodile hunting in Hyde Park, before returning to Bulgaria to view their recently discovered Loch Ness Monster, discovered to attract tourists, along with yesterdays discovery of the oldest civilisation in the world

[mikeonb4c]

Solar is definitely the way to go IMHO although it is still rather pricey.

To fully charge the LB you need (1) a voltage higher than that usually produced by the alternator and (2) a means of regulating this to suit the battery being charged and the state of charge.

Get a solar panel and suitable control unit and voila I fitted a 70w semi flexible panel (output about 20v) at the rear of the AFT linked via a controller to the Zig CF9. This keeps everything nicely charged including the SB via a two way VSR. Several days camping with the fridge running is no problem but park up facing North for best results

Solar panel controllers are designed to charge batteries as standard. And the energy is free. Of course if you keep the vehicle in a garage when not in use it's less effective...

Interesting post Jaws. What did your setup cost and do you have a link(s) to where to buy the stuff? I was particularly interested in you mentioning semi-flexible - is this a consideration if fitting to a car (Bongo) roof and if so, why?

[Alison01326]

Easy answer then Mike - you either connect your charger via an inverter to the starter battery and leave your Bongo on the street with the engine running (and keys in the ignition) for 24 hours.

Or take the leisure battery off and and charge it indoors every 3 months or so.

Or how about giving it a good charge via a mains lead if staying on a campsite with a EHU?

I'm probably missing the point here, because I got lost a long time ago (so I am going back to Page 1 and adding my five pennorth), but if you go the route of wiring a CTek/Lidl type charger in, you don't need to wait until you to go to a campsite to hook up - just buy one of these http://www.campervanaccessories.co.uk/m ... p-114.html and do it at home (or if you live in a penthouse apartment, go and park on a friend's drive and use same).

[missfixit70]

Mike was looking at it from a point of view of someone who couldn't park their vehicle within plugging in range of their house